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The Open Carry and Strict Scrutiny bill has been filed

ixtow

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Nov 25, 2006
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5,038
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Suwannee County, FL
So you used a preposition to end a sentence with. That doesn't change the tone of the bell's ring.

Keep shining your bright light. We enjoy what it reveals.

[curtsey]

They shone the light upon it themselves. Since when do Democrats care about Property Rights from any angle except trying to deprive us of those rights, and even the property itself? This is a very attention-getting turnaround of pretending to suddenly care about something they've spent their careers attacking and undermining. Did they think it would just slide by unnoticed? They're so used to dealing with their own obtuse constituency, they've dulled themselves and forget how to handle smart people...
 
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77zach

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Bogdanoff went Full Retard and was the only thing that stopped OC from happening last time around. She then got tarred and feathered for it and replaced by an actual Democrat. The only time I've witnessed a more one-sided election, is when it's uncontested.

I don't know of any of the previous RINOs being replaced by anything more favorable.

But, if just one Democrat goes in for it, then the RINOs can't hide anymore. If a DEMOCRAT is OK with it, how can a Republican not? With Sheriff's already speaking in favor, the FSA has to look like a house divided in order to oppose it... Arranging to put that foot forward at the outset is the best move Florida Carry has made to date. Well played.

Bogdanoff was not alone, she was the one designated and willing to take the fall. There is one Democrat senator, possibly two, who will vote for the OC bill. I don't know if it will matter though if they're not willing to co sponsor it, which I don't think they will. There are some new Republicans, but the only ones I know who are truly anti OC and right to bear arms are Dean and Latvala. Portilla is an anti, but he may be unwilling to vote no if there is enough support to make him hear the bill.
 

ixtow

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Bogdanoff was not alone, she was the one designated and willing to take the fall.
True. How many more will volunteer to be cannon fodder?

There is one Democrat senator, possibly two, who will vote for the OC bill. I don't know if it will matter though if they're not willing to co sponsor it, which I don't think they will.
It's up to us to point out the contrast.

There are some new Republicans, but the only ones I know who are truly anti OC and right to bear arms are Dean and Latvala.
Dean. A truly evil man if there ever was one...

Portilla is an anti, but he may be unwilling to vote no if there is enough support to make him hear the bill.
Plenty of them voted yes knowing that Bogdanoff was going to be their whipping girl. I think we're going to find far more anti's than previously known... Florida is where old RINOs come to die and hang on to their glory days of being good-ol-boys who get away with murder... If only they'd die faster...
 

hammer6

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Bogdanoff went Full Retard and was the only thing that stopped OC from happening last time around. She then got tarred and feathered for it and replaced by an actual Democrat. The only time I've witnessed a more one-sided election, is when it's uncontested.

I don't know of any of the previous RINOs being replaced by anything more favorable.

But, if just one Democrat goes in for it, then the RINOs can't hide anymore. If a DEMOCRAT is OK with it, how can a Republican not? With Sheriff's already speaking in favor, the FSA has to look like a house divided in order to oppose it... Arranging to put that foot forward at the outset is the best move Florida Carry has made to date. Well played.



That would be the tipping point; a democrat smoking out the RINOs. Not in the drug-using sense, but since a democrat was mentioned I figured it needed clarification... You know what I mean.

Democrats around the nation have spent over a decade relying on the Blues behind the Red lines. the RINOs mean that the democrats hold a majority even when it looks like they don't. RINOs still get paid and still get the same benefits, so they play ball to keep their cushy jobs. They lose intentionally and get rewarded for it. Essentially, democrats learned how to extend Welfare to their pretend opponents in the political arena, and RINOs love receiving it.

The "property rights" criers will be allowed to bleat a while, then soundly smacked by simply saying "Property rights have never been an issue in this, nothing on this bill detracts from property rights and anyone who says otherwise is a damn liar." Give them rope, let them out themselves, then pull the lever...

The House is unlikely to be the problem, as last time...

The only property rights issue I see is the desire to create a signage statute that grants power to property owners, and legalizes their desire to persecute a certain class of people that they deem unworthy or less than human. It's no different from making a statute that grants LEOs the power to legitimize color-of-law persecution. It's not property rights, it's about over-enhancing property rights to the point that they can be used as a weapon against gun owners.

It's one thing to have the right to prohibit anyone you want from entering upon your property, upon which this law has no impact. Quite another to grant them an extension of State Power to attack someone who simply didn't notice the tiny, poorly-written, obscured sign... Gun owners generally have no interest in giving their money to businesses who hate them. But, there are plenty of anti-gun zealots looking for any excuse to attack and persecute those with whom they disagree, and that's exactly what signage laws are. I completely agree with a property owner's right to prohibit whatever and whoever they feel like. I don't know any gun owner who disagrees with that, because most of them are also property owners themselves. We have no desire to rob anyone of their property rights. But, to inappropriately enhance those rights to the point of converting the right into a license to persecute and criminalize people that they label a "the enemy," is going too damn far.

It's about converting property rights into the right to persecute with weight of law. Something democrats always, always, always push for in everything they do. It isn't new. Democrats look for a way to persecute everyone they disagree with every single chance they get. They're hiding this particular attempt behind a fraudulent "property rights" argument.

Property owners already have the right to ask people to leave for any reason or no reason. This bill does not change that.

If, once asked to leave, a person does not do so, that's trespassing. This law already exists and this bill does not change it. If a person is armed and refuses to leave, that's armed trespass. A Felony! The law for this already exists and this bill does not change it.

The more you mess with settled law, the more it has to be re-visited and re-settled... Just leave it alone. Property rights are already enshrined and protected. This bill has zero impact on them, and appropriately so.

There is no problem here except for the usual democrat agenda of trying to get a persecution clause added to any and every law they think they can get it to stick to... I ended that sentence with a preposition, among other grammatical offenses throughout.




i hope florida carry does not endorse a bill that has "signage language" in it. that's one step forward, 2 steps back.
 

notalawyer

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Florida
True, I just assumed because it's coming from a supposed OC supporter.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

Anything is possible. I remember last time Evers offered an amendment requiring training and retention holsters in an attempt to draw out some of the shenanigans of the FSA.
 
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77zach

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Anything is possible. I remember last time Evers offered an amendment requiring training and retention holsters in an attempt to draw out some of the shenanigans of the FSA.

In this case that additional language is so poorly written, that if it gets included and passes, it will do nothing but invite more litigation. It really does not prohibit anything.
That's true too. The retailers are not arguing in good faith. They want to appear pro gun and sink this bill.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 

notalawyer

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That's true too. The retailers are not arguing in good faith. They want to appear pro gun and sink this bill.

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They never have. They always put on a pro(ish) public face and then fight tooth and nail behind the scenes. The FSA on the other hand is usually very public in their anti-firearm stance.
 

hammer6

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77zach

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what i meant to say was, signage that held weight of law. obviously, any private business can prohibit whomever they want from entering their property. but i don't want them to have legal power in a sign.

It will come, hopefully derailing it from becoming law or being dismissed for the silliness it is. Something is going on, there was no need to mention signs at all. I'm not even sure what this amendment is saying. Are you?
 
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Raventai

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Dixie county, florida
It will come, hopefully derailing it from becoming law or being dismissed for the silliness it is. Something is going on, there was no need to mention signs at all. I'm not even sure what this amendment is saying. Are you?

I read it as you are not allowed to open carry onto private property where signs are posted. emphasis on private businesses

it has nothing about penalties, so I am not sure that would create such it just seams to reinforce the existing trespass scheme.

unlike concealed carry, when you open carry you cannot just blow by ignoring signs anyway, you are openly carrying where the property owner can see it. if they don't want you and your gun there you should not be there.

As long as this does not escalate penalties where if i accidentally don't see the sign and just get asked to leave I don't have a big problem with it. personally I do not intend to open carry "in town" so it does not bother me. but I know others have other ideas about open carry, that's what freedom is about.
 

hammer6

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It will come, hopefully derailing it from becoming law or being dismissed for the silliness it is. Something is going on, there was no need to mention signs at all. I'm not even sure what this amendment is saying. Are you?

i feel like they put it in there to reinforce the private property rights, but they have clearly made it ambiguously gay. they've made "requirements" without stating what said requirements are. the way it is now, you'll be able to bypass the sign until someone asks you to leave. just like in the past.

as long as the sign doesn't say "no trespassing". right?
 

notalawyer

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Florida
i feel like they put it in there to reinforce the private property rights, but they have clearly made it ambiguously gay. they've made "requirements" without stating what said requirements are. the way it is now, you'll be able to bypass the sign until someone asks you to leave. just like in the past.

as long as the sign doesn't say "no trespassing". right?

In the last hearing the Florida Chamber of Commerce expressed concern about private property rights.
 

The Truth

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