stainless1911
Banned
Thanks PD, I have seen similar maps, just never one of Michigan.
PFZ is our current priority and we tend to keep our powder dry for that issue.
As for this bill, we had some concerns already laid out in this thread. If you feel our lack of lobbying for this bill has hurt it and that will prevent you from "supporting" us in the future. I'm sorry.
Perhaps you'd consider joining our organization and becoming involved with our leadership if you'd like more input into what we do...?
IF Michigan currently did NOT have PTP/Registration, but a bill was going through the legislature to enact it, would anyone here support it?
Would anyone support a bill to register shotguns/rifles so those who don't own handguns can openly carry them in the GFSZ?
I would be opposed to the above scenarios, which makes me opposed to keeping the current PTP/Registration scheme
§ 278-40. Firearms; gun-free school zone; violations and penalties. said:A. Short title. This section shall be known and may be cited as the "Gun-Free School Zone Ordinance."
B. Possession of firearms in school zones.
(1) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a firearm at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.
(2) Subsection B(1) shall not apply to the possession of a firearm if any of the following apply:
(a) The firearm is possessed on private property not part of school grounds.
(b) The individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State of Michigan.
(c) The firearm is not loaded and in a locked container, or in a locked firearms rack which is on a motor vehicle.
(d) The firearm is in the possession of an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual.
(e) The firearm is in the possession of a law enforcement officer.
C. Violations and penalties. Any person violating any of the provisions of this section shall be deemed guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction thereof, shall be fined in an amount not exceeding $500 or be imprisoned for a period not exceeding 90 days, or be both so fined and imprisoned, in the discretion of the court.
D. Signs to be posted. The City is authorized to post signs around school zones giving warning of prohibition of the possession of firearms in a school zone.
I do understand your point and feel it is valid. And, I personally agree with you to a point. The salient part of this discussion is that we are dealing with a a federal law that impacts what we do at the state level. I think that if the benefit concerned state law, meaning that the gfsza was a state law, the support would have been there for this bill because we could envision that law being tossed at some point in time. I also feel that if the legislature would have included a voluntary system of licensure, most here would have heartily supported this bill. But, as it is written, within the confines of present reality, the gain in one area would have been a loss in another. Yes, registration is terrible, but so is the federal gfsza.
This summarizes MOC's leadership's position. It is a win/loss.
I'm sorry if some value the elimination of purchase permits more than the GFSZ exemption. That doesn't get rid of the fact the bill is win/lose.
People are free to join or not join MOC. I won't beg anyone and I definitely won't swing my board vote based on one person (esp. one who might/was thinking about becoming a member -- but isn't a member).
To my detractor: have you called your rep? Have you lobbied around Lansing for this bill? What have you done for this bill other than complain MOC won't "support" it?
Would it surprise you to know I have just as many people upset that I won't oppose it? It's lonely at the top. Why don't you join me?
"Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown." -King Henry VI
On second thought, keep your $20, we don't want it!
Am I really reading that some are advocating to keep a gun control law on the books?!?!?! Get rid of the PTP/Registration scheme.
Why not get a CPL? If one is to give their name to the government, I'd rather it be once, and let them guess as to how many handguns I have, rather than know exactly how many I have, when I got them, etc.
Besides, just because one has a CPL doesn't mean they even own a gun. They might have it for a taser, or simply to borrow a friends gun on occasion.
Yeah I was hoping to hear from Q on this.
You're the one who asked me to join this thread.
You asked for the organizations leaderships thoughts. I gave them to you and I even explained the reason behind them to you. You didn't like them so you began to berate the organization. How would you like me to react?
I appreciate all the hard work you do( I think most of us on here do), and I think MOC has done lots of great things, that's why I was so disappointed to hear that they want to keep PP and registration.
Wouldnt the LTP be argued against the ordinance as well? This sounds like it might be overstepping 1102 as well.
MCL 123.1102 said:Regulation of pistols or other firearms.
Sec. 2.
A local unit of government shall not impose special taxation on, enact or enforce any ordinance or regulation pertaining to, or regulate in any other manner the ownership, registration, purchase, sale, transfer, transportation, or possession of pistols or other firearms, ammunition for pistols or other firearms, or components of pistols or other firearms, except as otherwise provided by federal law or a law of this state.
I think MOC has done lots of great things, that's why I was so disappointed to hear that they want to keep PP and registration.
See, that is where you are wrong. MOC does not want to keep PP and registration. We want it gone as much as you. We just don't want to open up a large segment of citizens who do not have or want a CPL to a federal gun charge. That's why Phil attempted to get language added to clear up that issue. When we were ignored, we chose to stand neutral and not lobby for or against the bill. There really wasn't any other position for us to take. We are MOC, open carry means more to us than most and not all our members(or non members) have CPL's.