OC Appearance

[Kingfish]

I point out that if the goal is to normalize OC, appearance WILL change how others react. Do you not agree with that for some odd reason?

Actually I don't. To normalize OC we need NORMAL folks OCing. MORNAL folks come in all shapes, sizes, have all kinds of hair styles, beard styles, they wear different kinds of clothes.

If the only folks that carry look the same then there will be no "NORMALIZATION." You see, what is "normal" for you is not normal for me.

You see, I support EVERYONE defending themselves and their family. You apparently do not.

 

[wrightme]

Actually I don't. To normalize OC we need NORMAL folks OCing. MORNAL folks come in all shapes, sizes, have all kinds of hair styles, beard styles, they wear different kinds of clothes.

If the only folks that carry look the same then there will be no "NORMALIZATION." You see, what is "normal" for you is not normal for me.

You see, I support EVERYONE defending themselves and their family. You apparently do not.

Um, are you actually attempting to claim that folks do NOT judge others based upon appearance? That flies in the face of reality.


Go find ONE post where I do NOT support everyone defending themselves. That is simply false. In fact, here is what I specifically stated:

I will go about my daily life with my properly holstered handgun....I think I have read this line somewhere before.

Which is a very good thing to do, which I do encourage everyone to do, no matter how they dress or appear.

I do not see how you could have read that, and then tried to claim that I "apparently do not" 'support everyone defending themselves and their family.'


I suggest you will have the best success in conversation by actually accepting that I will state my position, and you don't need to jump through your ass to make up stuff I don't say.

 

[Kingfish]

Go find ONE post where I do NOT support everyone defending themselves.

But, if you were to come directly from digging a ditch to the mall to shop, and still looked like you just got out of a ditch, that WILL change how others view you,

You obviously don't support someone going from a dirty environment to a retail environment if they are OCing. Since some folks either can't get or don't want a CC permit then OC is the only way to legally carry. I read YOUR statement as you don't want someone OCing in dirty cloths....Thus not being able to defend themselves.

 

[wrightme]

You obviously don't support someone going from a dirty environment to a retail environment if they are OCing.

That is simply false. I made no such statement. Can't you actually understand that the words I use are the ones that I choose to convey my meaning?

Do you not believe that other people WILL judge others by appearance? I DO support someone carrying, NO MATTER HOW THEY DRESS. I stated that very clearly. But, I also DO understand that others do NOT view it the same. Do you understand that also?

Since some folks either can't get or don't want a CC permit then OC is the only way to legally carry. I read YOUR statement as you don't want someone OCing in dirty cloths....Thus not being able to defend themselves.

Then you either flat out cannot comprehend what I actually wrote, or you simply WANT to misrepresent what I actually write to fit your spin.


I stated it several times, but I will get it completely blunt here. Carry how you want, dressed how you want, and acting how you want. Do you get it yet?


See the other post I just did, the one right above your most recent one?

which I do encourage everyone to do, no matter how they dress or appear .

How can you still misinterpret my position?

 

[WalkingWolf]

That is simply false. I made no such statement. Can't you actually understand that the words I use are the ones that I choose to convey my meaning?

Do you not believe that other people WILL judge others by appearance? I DO support someone carrying, NO MATTER HOW THEY DRESS. I stated that very clearly. But, I also DO understand that others do NOT view it the same. Do you understand that also?

Then you either flat out cannot comprehend what I actually wrote, or you simply WANT to misrepresent what I actually write to fit your spin.


I stated it several times, but I will get it completely blunt here. Carry how you want, dressed how you want, and acting how you want. Do you get it yet?


See the other post I just did, the one right above your most recent one? How can you still misinterpret my position?

Judgements my friend, you are being judged by your words. It is his right and mine to interpret those words. You are clearly doing exactly what you claim you are not. If it was not a problem for you how others dress while OCing it would not be. That it pretty simple and straight forward.

Your attitude IMO is far more harmful than my farm clothes to the PR campaign for OC. See you discourage OC from those who do not have the will to stand up to bullyism/snobbery. It just happens that Kingfish and myself do.

If we want to normalize OC we need to encourage OC, and make people feel wanted to join our exercise in freedom. BTW you should examine the photo that is on the top of OCDO, how much more normal/diverse can you get...

 

[wrightme]

Judgements my friend, you are being judged by your words. It is his right and mine to interpret those words. You are clearly doing exactly what you claim you are not. If it was not a problem for you how others dress while OCing it would not be. That it pretty simple and straight forward.

No, you both are misrepresenting what I am saying.
If you are going to judge me on my words, at least represent them fairly. That includes accepting exact statements, as opposed to ignoring those statements.

Your attitude IMO is far more harmful than my farm clothes to the PR campaign for OC. See you discourage OC from those who do not have the will to stand up to bullyism/snobbery. It just happens that Kingfish and myself do.

Once again, you are completely misrepresenting what I say. I do NOT discourage anyone from OC. But, I DO understand that others WILL judge us by how we act and by how we appear. Do you not believe this happens in public?

If we want to normalize OC we need to encourage OC, and make people feel wanted to join our exercise in freedom. BTW you should examine the photo that is on the top of OCDO, how much more normal/diverse can you get...

I do encourage OC. I encourage it however people desire to dress. But, if the desire is to normalize OC, it IS beneficial to recognize that others will judge us by how we act and appear, and to understand that if we act and appear better, we WILL be viewed better. That does help. I simply do not see how you two can misconstrue that to be me "discouraging OC."



As to the photo at the top, do you believe those persons are dressed closer to how I am presenting, or to how kingfish is presenting?



As for "my attitude" being harmful? What do you feel is this "attitude", and what is harmful about it?



Now, you want to judge me by my words. Here: "which I do encourage everyone to do, no matter how they dress or appear . " What do those words tell you?

 

[WalkingWolf]

No, you both are misrepresenting what I am saying.
If you are going to judge me on my words, at least represent them fairly. That includes accepting exact statements, as opposed to ignoring those statements.

Once again, you are completely misrepresenting what I say. I do NOT discourage anyone from OC. But, I DO understand that others WILL judge us by how we act and by how we appear. Do you not believe this happens in public?

I do encourage OC. I encourage it however people desire to dress. But, if the desire is to normalize OC, it IS beneficial to recognize that others will judge us by how we act and appear, and to understand that if we act and appear better, we WILL be viewed better. That does help. I simply do not see how you two can misconstrue that to be me "discouraging OC."



As to the photo at the top, do you believe those persons are dressed closer to how I am presenting, or to how kingfish is presenting?



As for "my attitude" being harmful? What do you feel is this "attitude", and what is harmful about it?



Now, you want to judge me by my words. Here: "which I do encourage everyone to do, no matter how they dress or appear . " What do those words tell you?

I respectfully disagree with you~~I have a right to my opinions of your words. You don't like my opinion and disagree with it, that is your choice, but don't demand I mold to your mindset, anymore that trying to tell me that I scare people dressing not like you. Judging people is a two way street.

 

[wrightme]

I respectfully disagree with you~~I have a right to my opinions of your words.

So, if someone tells you that they support OC, you don't agree with them?

You don't like my opinion and disagree with it, that is your choice, but don't demand I mold to your mindset, anymore that trying to tell me that I scare people dressing not like you. Judging people is a two way street.

You are free to have an opinion. But, when you create a false impression of what someone actually says, you are basing your opinion upon a misrepresentation of what someone actually says.



I KNOW that people judge others based upon appearance and actions. Do you never see this happen?


As for 'two way street,' you are judging me based upon my words. Who have I judged?

 

[WalkingWolf]

So, if someone tells you that they support OC, you don't agree with them?
You are free to have an opinion. But, when you create a false impression of what someone actually says, you are basing your opinion upon a misrepresentation of what someone actually says.



I KNOW that people judge others based upon appearance and actions. Do you never see this happen?


As for 'two way street,' you are judging me based upon my words. Who have I judged?

I don't agree with you, I believe you believe that the only people who support OC fit into your mold. You created the impression others have of you, no one else. You judged me, and others who are diversely dressed while OCing. Clearly if you had no problem with others dress you would not be defending your supposed non judgements. If you believe that dressing in farm clothes or tattered jeans or whatever actually normalizes OC and encourages it by all means say so.

But to say Yadda Yadda Yadda~~but you are scaring people if you do it your way.

 

[WalkingWolf]

I KNOW that people judge others based upon appearance and actions. Do you never see this happen?

Oopps forgot to answer this~~Yes I have and I am seeing it happen right here. In fact I am making judgements on written word(actions).

 

[wrightme]

I don't agree with you, I believe you believe that the only people who support OC fit into your mold.

Then you have completely misread me. And you have misread me IN SPITE of my clear statements of what I believe.

You created the impression others have of you, no one else.

No, you and kingfish have created that impression of me. Other posters HAVE taken the position that you have created for me, but I have not.

You judged me, and others who are diversely dressed while OCing.

Go ahead, support that claim with any post where I have done this.

Clearly if you had no problem with others dress you would not be defending your supposed non judgements.

No, I clearly have not done what you claim.

If you believe that dressing in farm clothes or tattered jeans or whatever actually normalizes OC and encourages it by all means say so.

I do not agree that what you claim is the case. But, as example, in AZ, that would not likely get a second look. In downtown hartford, a different story.

Normalizing OC WILL require attention to the PR aspect of it, whether you can understand this or not. The simple reality is that people DO judge others based upon appearances. It ain't right, but it IS reality.

But to say Yadda Yadda Yadda~~but you are scaring people if you do it your way.

Go ahead, cite the post where you feel I have said that.


In Connecticut, it is said that OCers can get charged with Disturbing the Peace for OC, even though statute does not say that. I do NOT support the bias I see in the outside world around you. But, I DO see that the world IS that way. That does NOT mean I am supportive of that bias.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Carnac while you educating us on others judgements, why don't you just explain what those negative judgements would be to NOT dressing as the norm that you clearly consider detrimental to OC? You have stated over and over that we are free to do as we wish(Ohhh thank you for giving us that freedom) but that we will incur judgements~~What are they?

 

[wrightme]

Oopps forgot to answer this~~Yes I have and I am seeing it happen right here. In fact I am making judgements on written word(actions).

Then you should fully understand how false it is to make such judgements.


I do not hold the position you attribute to me, yet you falsely judge me based upon that.

In the same way, other people in public WILL falsely judge YOU based upon how you appear, whether it is accurate or not.


It is right in front of you, yet you seem blind to it.


NOW, when you OC, you do introduce a "fear" that others have into judgement. How do YOU want them to react to you? If you do not care a bit, then do whatever you desire. If you DO care a bit, at least be aware of possible reactions.


That is "being informed," and "making informed decisions." If I felt that how someone looks did not matter to others, I would not say a thing about it at all.



I typically go in blue jeans, tennis shoes, and a non-white t-shirt. Usually clean, but not always. I am not a "Dockers and dress shoes" guy. When I OC, I understand that others will view me based upon how I look and act. I choose my attire, and understand that it does change how others react.

 

[wrightme]

Carnac while you educating us on others judgements, why don't you just explain what those negative judgements would be to NOT dressing as the norm that you clearly consider detrimental to OC? You have stated over and over that we are free to do as we wish(Ohhh thank you for giving us that freedom) but that we will incur judgements~~What are they?

First, show the post where I supposedly did so.

 

[WalkingWolf]

First, show the post where I supposedly did so.

Is there enough bandwidth? Honestly if you can't see it for yourself me pointing it out will not help. In fact you just used the word "fear". Why are you so concerned of others judgements, let alone mine? If I am wrong and you are right don't you believe that you need no vindication?

 

[wrightme]

Is there enough bandwidth? Honestly if you can't see it for yourself me pointing it out will not help. In fact you just used the word "fear".

Yes, I did use the word "fear." Hoplophobia IS a "fear." Do you agree with that statement?

Why are you so concerned of others judgements, let alone mine.

I am not concerned with such. Where did you get that from?

If I am wrong and you are right don't you believe that you need no vindication.

I am not sure what that last sentence is getting at.

If I were wrong, OC would already be normalized. As it stands, many areas still have multitudes of people who "fear" a MWAG. Do you agree or disagree with the specific in bold?

 

[WalkingWolf]

Yes, I did use the word "fear." Hoplophobia IS a "fear." Do you agree with that statement?I am not concerned with such. Where did you get that from?
I am not sure what that last sentence is getting at.

If I were wrong, OC would already be normalized. As it stands, many areas still have multitudes of people who "fear" a MWAG. Do you agree or disagree with the specific in bold?

So You believe that because others have misplaced fears that we should react to comfort them by dressing as they approve. How would anyone know what a person finds appropriate, the country is diverse with diverse opinions and judgements. IMO a person could go nuts worrying about the judgements of others and trying to please them. In 15 years NEVER a man with a gun incident. NEVER. In fact I have diverse people comment and talk to me, and still not one person giving me the evil eye. I guess I just make people feel comfortable, even to the point of a lady asking to stroke my hair while armed in a checkout line, I guess I really put the fear in her. Though it did kinda tick off the wife.

I guess you have to live with your own fears as we all do. The thing is do you control them or do they control you?

 

[wrightme]

So You believe <snip>?

Do you agree that Hoplophobia is a "fear?"

As it stands, many areas still have multitudes of people who "fear" a MWAG. Do you agree or disagree with the specific in bold?

Do you agree or disagree?

 

[skopro]

Talk about hijacking a thread. This has gotten a little bit off topic between two people in the wrong state forum.
I would suggest that we get back to the topic at hand.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Do you agree that Hoplophobia is a "fear?"

Do you agree or disagree?

Frankly my dear I don't give a dayum~That is the problem of the person with the fear, it is certainly NOT my responsibility to counsel them or comfort them on their fear, let alone guess who is fearful of what. It is IMO not only foolish but dangerous to bend to society by fears. Do you believe that the fear of firearms is based on clothing or firearms? Maybe you need to take this subject to Huffington Post and get a education on what the real fear of firearms is based on, because IMHO you are full of it on appearance. In fact I'm going to bet the anti handgun liberals are going to bash the daylights out of you for your opinions on appearance, not for your appearance.