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80% pistol rules

qqq1

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2009
Messages
81
Location
Saginaw, Michigan, USA
Hi there, been a while since I've visited. Who can give me a for sure answer (as opposed to the "well I think maybe" answers I've found) to the question of building my own pistol from an 80% kit? If if I buy one and complete it does it need to be serialized and registered? I believe federal law says no but it seems as though Michigan law says yes, simply because it's a pistol in Michigan. Has anyone done an 80% pistol build? What did you do? Thanks.
 

ManoftheSea

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2017
Messages
14
Location
Outside Manassas, VA
You would need a lawyer to get as close to "for-sure" as possible. I am not a lawyer, so I cannot give you legal advice.

You aren't purchasing a pistol, so you don't need a permit to purchase.

You are possessing a pistol, so your pistol needs to be registered. No law says your pistol must be serialized. You will be unable to transfer possession (possibly interpreted as even letting someone else use it at an event.)

If you are ever found with the pistol and it is not registered, it is considered contraband and will be confiscated.

Therefore, you must register the pistol without a serial number. Put "no serial number". Keep your copy of the form.
 

Michigander

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2007
Messages
4,836
Location
Mulligan's Valley
You need to put a number on it and register it with a permit to purchase or a RI060. I know of at least one instance of a home built pistol which the builder intentionally put a ridiculously long serial number on, and it wouldn't fit into their database. So if you want to avoid that, probably stick to something shorter, but certainly feel free to be clever or a wise ass with the number, that isn't against the law at all.
 

ManoftheSea

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2017
Messages
14
Location
Outside Manassas, VA
MCL 28.422: " person shall not purchase, carry, possess, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol as prescribed in this section"

I see that the permit to purchase seems to serve as the registration as well. In such case, you might employ the legal fiction that you are acquiring the pistol from yourself, and therefore fill out the forms yourself for yourself. I still see no law that requires you to serialize the pistol.

There are certainly benefits to serializing the pistol. If you were to one day decide to sell it, you would need it to be serialized. If you die and want to leave it to next-of-kin, you would need it to be serialized. But you are not *required* to serialize it.
 

Evil Creamsicle

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2009
Messages
1,271
Location
Police State, USA
MCL 28.422: " person shall not purchase, carry, possess, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol as prescribed in this section"

I see that the permit to purchase seems to serve as the registration as well. In such case, you might employ the legal fiction that you are acquiring the pistol from yourself, and therefore fill out the forms yourself for yourself. I still see no law that requires you to serialize the pistol.

There are certainly benefits to serializing the pistol. If you were to one day decide to sell it, you would need it to be serialized. If you die and want to leave it to next-of-kin, you would need it to be serialized. But you are not *required* to serialize it.
750.232 Purchasers of firearms; registration. said:
Sec. 232.

Registration of purchasers of pistols, etc.—Any person engaged in any way or to any extent in the business of selling at retail, guns, pistols, other fire-arms or silencers for fire-arms who shall fail or neglect to keep a register in which shall be entered the name, age, occupation and residence (if residing in the city with the street number of such residence) of each and every purchaser of such guns, pistols, other fire-arms or silencers for fire-arms together with the number or other mark of identification, if any, on such gun, pistol, other fire-arms or silencer for fire-arms, which said register shall be open to the inspection of all peace officers at all times, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.
So... even the law about maintaining a registry makes it sound like the number or other identifying mark isn't 'required'.
Curious. I thought someplace a serial number was specifically required for pistols.
 

Hevymetal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2012
Messages
259
Location
Clinton Twp
The reasonable idea would be to put the serial number 1 on your first build.

Nemo
I'd like to see their faces if you gave it a serial number of 121546416323423423423423423423451487498435135419840016165485450049878910054684987987. Put that in your system and watch the database go poof :)
 

Evil Creamsicle

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2009
Messages
1,271
Location
Police State, USA
I'd like to see their faces if you gave it a serial number of 121546416323423423423423423423451487498435135419840016165485450049878910054684987987. Put that in your system and watch the database go poof :)
My friend did something like this at my suggestion... it was hilarious.
I guessed (correctly) that their legacy system wouldn't have more than a 32 character limit, so he made the serial number 34 characters.
They complained because it wouldn't go in their system and his response was "well its illegal to change it, so that's your problem".
Not sure what they ultimately did.
 

xd shooter

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2010
Messages
337
Location
usa
I built an AR Pistol using an 80% lower, AND installed a serial number.

But, as I intended to SBR it with a Form 1, I also put my Trust name and location on it.

I assumed that since they asked for a serial number on the Pistol Permit form that one might be required, otherwise how would the registration and transfer of Pistols in MI even work? (Yes I agree that registration and transfer paperwork do NOT work to prevent crime, so...) :)
 

color of law

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Messages
5,359
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
ARTICLE I
DECLARATION OF RIGHTS
§ 6 Bearing of arms.

Sec. 6. Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.
I don't see anywhere in this section of Michigan Constitution where the legislature has authority to regulate firearms. Can somebody help me out here?
 
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