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Second Amendment Sanctuary Movement Spreads To Kentucky

Ghost1958

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So if a county deputy sheriff sees a person carrying an AK 47 and 500 rounds of ammo into a school, he can't act on that because the county is a 2A Sanctuary and the "no guns in schools" statute is an infringement of the 2A? Is that how it works? Now, a city policeman is not affected by the county ordinance because he is not a county employees so we have to call a city policeman to arrest the gunman, but once he arrests the gunman the county jailer won't take him into custody because he is a county official and the 2A sanctuary ordinance says he can't be involved in any infringements of the 2A. Sounds great! Where do we sign up?
When you hear of a policeman seeing anything like you described and actually preventing a school shooting you let me know. Anywhere in the nation.

And the city cop wont be doing squat either if he operates inside the county as the sheriff outranks him and will be tasked with arresting said city officer. And the ability to deputize all the help he may require.

But let's go with your red herring. Said cop sees person going into a school armed as you describe. Nothing prevents the cop from following and observing . And IF it becomes clear the armed person is launching an attack on the school the said cop is free to act.
That's assuming one cop would ever place himself in that position before calling an army and waiting until they show up long after the damage is done.

Should be plenty of places to sign up in a little while .
 
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gutshot II

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Central Ky.
When you hear of a policeman seeing anything like you described and actually preventing a school shooting you let me know. Anywhere in the nation.

And the city cop wont be doing squat either if he operates inside the county as the sheriff outranks him and will be tasked with arresting said city officer. And the ability to deputize all the help he may require.

But let's go with your red herring. Said cop sees person going into a school armed as you describe. Nothing prevents the cop from following and observing . And IF it becomes clear the armed person is launching an attack on the school the said cop is free to act.
That's assuming one cop would ever place himself in that position before calling an army and waiting until they show up long after the damage is done.

Should be plenty of places to sign up in a little while .
They stop them all the time. You know where you have 27 students killed and then the cops show up and the shooter kills himself. All of these things that I have seen only apply to county employees. Now I guess it is possible to have one passed by fiscal court and another by the city council. The sheriff in my county can't give any orders to a city policeman. He could deputize him, but as soon as he did that the city policeman would be covered by the county ordinance and unable to act. I'll let you explain all of this to the Courier-Journal reporter when they come by and want an interview on how county employees can no longer keep guns out of our schools or anywhere else to boot. It should be a great story. You might even get your picture in the paper. This is going to be entertaining.
 

Ghost1958

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Kentucky
They stop them all the time. You know where you have 27 students killed and then the cops show up and the shooter kills himself. All of these things that I have seen only apply to county employees. Now I guess it is possible to have one passed by fiscal court and another by the city council. The sheriff in my county can't give any orders to a city policeman. He could deputize him, but as soon as he did that the city policeman would be covered by the county ordinance and unable to act. I'll let you explain all of this to the Courier-Journal reporter when they come by and want an interview on how county employees can no longer keep guns out of our schools or anywhere else to boot. It should be a great story. You might even get your picture in the paper. This is going to be entertaining.
Well your half right. The shooter kills 27 kids then then usually leaves or kills himself, then the cops gather an army , enter, and frog March the survivors out past their MRAP for the cameras.
Your scenario of a cop seeing a person going into a school armed with a rifle and arresting him preventing a school shooting has never happened and you know it.

I've never agreed to be interviewed by the liberal handbook the Courier Journal. Never will. Though my photo has been in it a few times.

I take it you dont support citizens being carrying in schools.? That's just a tiny reason these 2A sanctuary are being proposed . Infringement and gov overeach.

I do.
 

solus

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Forgive foray into the conversation

you don't truly believe the end version(s) from the nice LEs that the shooter took their own life do you?
 

Ghost1958

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Kentucky
Forgive foray into the conversation

you don't truly believe the end version(s) from the nice LEs that the shooter took their own life do you?
Sometimes yes , sometimes no.

LE , as evidenced by the crowd being attacked , usually wont enter until the shooting has stopped after the shooter offed himself.

Other times I'm sure LE offed the shooter, but I have no problem with that.

Either way the whole story is orchestrated in most I instances.

Armed teachers and citizens if they are present as well are the only way to stop or mitigate the damage caused by active shooters.
 

Ghost1958

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Nov 5, 2015
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1,255
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Kentucky
They stop them all the time. You know where you have 27 students killed and then the cops show up and the shooter kills himself. All of these things that I have seen only apply to county employees. Now I guess it is possible to have one passed by fiscal court and another by the city council. The sheriff in my county can't give any orders to a city policeman. He could deputize him, but as soon as he did that the city policeman would be covered by the county ordinance and unable to act. I'll let you explain all of this to the Courier-Journal reporter when they come by and want an interview on how county employees can no longer keep guns out of our schools or anywhere else to boot. It should be a great story. You might even get your picture in the paper. This is going to be entertaining.
Newsflash for ya.

County officials nor anyone else keeps guns out of school now and never have.

We wouldn't have school shootings if they were now would we?

As far as sheriff vs city, the sheriff can't order a city cop to do anything .

But he can order him NOT to do something. Arrest him for violating a county ordinance, force him to relinquish a crime scene or not enter it in the first place.
 
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gutshot II

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Central Ky.
What ordinance are you looking at? All of the 2A ordinances that I've seen only apply to county officials, so there would be no arrest of the city policeman. He would be legal, while the same action by a county official would violate the ordinance. Please post whatever ordinance you are referencing.
 

color of law

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Guns in school didn't become a crime under federal law until 1990 even though the Feds have no authority over state schools, 10th. Amendment.

KY didn't pass a law about guns in schools until 1994, KRS 527.070.
 

Ghost1958

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Kentucky
What ordinance are you looking at? All of the 2A ordinances that I've seen only apply to county officials, so there would be no arrest of the city policeman. He would be legal, while the same action by a county official would violate the ordinance. Please post whatever ordinance you are referencing.
If the county sheriff is on board he CAN arrest a city cop for violating a county ordinance . I'm not referencing an existing ordinance , just the sheriffs autority.

If the county passes an ordinance of 2A sanctuary, the sheriff can arrest a city cop for violating it.

If you doubt me the Greenup county sheriff refused Greenup and KSP involvement in the investigation of the murder of a personal friend of mine. Not many years ago. Despite the best efforts of both to force their way into it.

He solved that case. And used his authority as sheriff to order both other agencies to stay out of the investigation.
 

color of law

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Another fact: between 1070 and 1989 there were only 15 persons killed by the shooter that were tied to 6 school shootings in the entire nation. 1 in 1974, 1 in 79, 1 in 84, 1 in 88, 2 in 89.
 

OC for ME

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White Oak Plantation
Simple remedy...cops stop being legal/illegal enforcers where the 2A is concerned and become right/wrong enforcers where the 2A is concerned.

If cops do not participate in the 2A sanctuary movement, all is for naught. I suspect that no cop will place his livelihood in dire straights when the rubber meets the road...no matter his personal views on the 2A.
 

solus

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Simple remedy...cops stop being legal/illegal enforcers where the 2A is concerned and become right/wrong enforcers where the 2A is concerned.

If cops do not participate in the 2A sanctuary movement, all is for naught. I suspect that no cop will place his livelihood in dire straights when the rubber meets the road...no matter his personal views on the 2A.
1577625288520.jpeg
 

color of law

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Simple remedy...cops stop being legal/illegal enforcers where the 2A is concerned and become right/wrong enforcers where the 2A is concerned.

If cops do not participate in the 2A sanctuary movement, all is for naught. I suspect that no cop will place his livelihood in dire straights when the rubber meets the road...no matter his personal views on the 2A.
So, money talks and bulls... walks.
 

Ghost1958

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Kentucky
Simple remedy...cops stop being legal/illegal enforcers where the 2A is concerned and become right/wrong enforcers where the 2A is concerned.

If cops do not participate in the 2A sanctuary movement, all is for naught. I suspect that no cop will place his livelihood in dire straights when the rubber meets the road...no matter his personal views on the 2A.
If a county votes itself sanctuary county that effectively prohibits the sheriff from enforcing gun regulation and the county jail from housing anyone arrested for a gun regulation violation.

To much emphasis on what the cops will or wont do.
On the whole they are spectacularly ineffective at enforcing gun regulation already.

Trust if there is enough push in a county to get it voted a 2a sanctuary the cops working that county will abide it, instead of trying to enforce what they know is unconstitutional in the face of guaranteed resistance.

Job doesn't pay enough to fight a small war every day or every week.
 

color of law

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When a person shows-up at a counsel meeting demanding justice from their elected officials, you can bet there are a 1,000 people supporting that one complainant. So, when a 100 people show-up at a counsel meeting you can bet there are 100,000 that support those 100 complainants. But whatever that ratio, the elected official knows there are a lot of people agreeing with those complaints.

Numbers count on either side of the argument, but the law of the land (constitution) will only support one of those sides. However, we live in a republic, meaning the majority cannot violate the minority's rights.
In Miranda v. Arizona, 384 U.S. 436, 491 (1966) the SC stated that “where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them.”

Taking that oath means something, and defying that oath is treason. And the ultimate punishment for treason is death, 18 U.S. Code § 2381. Sometimes our elected officials need a reminder.
 

color of law

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Kentucky Constitution:
SECTION 228 Oath of officers and attorneys. Members of the General Assembly and all officers, before they enter upon the execution of the duties of their respective offices, and all members of the bar, before they enter upon the practice of their profession, shall take the following oath or affirmation: I do solemnly swear (or affirm, as the case may be) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of this Commonwealth, and be faithful and true to the Commonwealth of Kentucky so long as I continue a citizen thereof, and that I will faithfully execute, to the best of my ability, the office of . . . . according to law; and I do further solemnly swear (or affirm) that since the adoption of the present Constitution, I, being a citizen of this State, have not fought a duel with deadly weapons within this State nor out of it, nor have I sent or accepted a challenge to fight a duel with deadly weapons, nor have I acted as second in carrying a challenge, nor aided or assisted any person thus offending, so help me God.
 

gutshot II

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Central Ky.
I have been having a lot of trouble finding a real 2A Sanctuary Resolution. I have heard a lot of conversations about them. I have heard some wonderful things that they can do to save our 2A but I haven't had much success finding any. Well, those days are over. The links below will take you to 3 different Resolutions. First, let us all understand that there is a big difference between a county ordinance and a county resolution. An ordinance is a law and can actually prohibit certain conduct or demand that certain actions be taken. An ordinance can have penalties in the form of fines and/or jail time for violations of the ordinance. An ordinance is enforceable. A resolution is just an expression of a hope, a wish or a plan. A resolution cannot force anybody to do anything or not do anything. There can be no punishment. The most common type of "resolution" is a "New Year's Resolution" where a person resolves to exercise more, lose weight or be kinder to their loved ones.

When I first started hearing about the Sanctuary Counties, it was about Second Amendment Sanctuary "Ordinances" or "SASO". I have now received two that have been passed by Ky. Counties. One is from Knott County and the other from Lewis County and they are both "Resolutions", not ordinances. These are what we are relying on to save our 2A rights. These are what will keep our constitution from crumbling. Here is the Resolution from Knott Co.:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z11jnrv8t6sabl8/Knott Co. 2nd A. Resolution.pdf?dl=0

And here is the piece of paper that will save the people of Lewis Co. from losing their guns:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nq5zgfqqidobf3l/Lewis Co. 2A Resolution.pdf?dl=0

I think these people have been hoodwinked. These "resolutions" are as weak as day-old piss.
Below is a "sample Resolution" that has been sent out in Virginia to help those counties set up their resolutions. This was prepared by the "Va. Citizen's Defense League".

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zjmj5xm1e3dimao/Model_Resolution.docx?dl=0

I'll have the Marshall Co. and the Harlan Co. resolutions soon.

Maybe we can use one of these to convict a county official of treason when he violates it.
 

Ghost1958

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Nov 5, 2015
Messages
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Kentucky
I have been having a lot of trouble finding a real 2A Sanctuary Resolution. I have heard a lot of conversations about them. I have heard some wonderful things that they can do to save our 2A but I haven't had much success finding any. Well, those days are over. The links below will take you to 3 different Resolutions. First, let us all understand that there is a big difference between a county ordinance and a county resolution. An ordinance is a law and can actually prohibit certain conduct or demand that certain actions be taken. An ordinance can have penalties in the form of fines and/or jail time for violations of the ordinance. An ordinance is enforceable. A resolution is just an expression of a hope, a wish or a plan. A resolution cannot force anybody to do anything or not do anything. There can be no punishment. The most common type of "resolution" is a "New Year's Resolution" where a person resolves to exercise more, lose weight or be kinder to their loved ones.

When I first started hearing about the Sanctuary Counties, it was about Second Amendment Sanctuary "Ordinances" or "SASO". I have now received two that have been passed by Ky. Counties. One is from Knott County and the other from Lewis County and they are both "Resolutions", not ordinances. These are what we are relying on to save our 2A rights. These are what will keep our constitution from crumbling. Here is the Resolution from Knott Co.:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z11jnrv8t6sabl8/Knott Co. 2nd A. Resolution.pdf?dl=0

And here is the piece of paper that will save the people of Lewis Co. from losing their guns:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nq5zgfqqidobf3l/Lewis Co. 2A Resolution.pdf?dl=0

I think these people have been hoodwinked. These "resolutions" are as weak as day-old piss.
Below is a "sample Resolution" that has been sent out in Virginia to help those counties set up their resolutions. This was prepared by the "Va. Citizen's Defense League".

https://www.dropbox.com/s/zjmj5xm1e3dimao/Model_Resolution.docx?dl=0

I'll have the Marshall Co. and the Harlan Co. resolutions soon.

Maybe we can use one of these to convict a county official of treason when he violates it.
I will not support a resolution in my county .
There is as gutshot said , no point to one.

Either an ordinance with teeth or leave it alone as there are no real threats from the state of ky to the RTKABA that are going to see the light of day.
 

gutshot II

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Location
Central Ky.
My biggest concern is that some of the people involved in this movement believe that these resolutions will protect them. The expectations are enormous. When they find out that the resolutions are meaningless, what will be their reaction? Will they think that the law has let them down and that this betrayal justifies violence. I am genuinely happy to see Ky. gun owners motivated to some action but this not going to solve anything. There is an argument to be made that big things can be built from small beginnings but this is less than small. The amount of hype involved in this is well beyond reasonable. There is also the danger that people feel like they have finished the job after passing these resolutions when, in fact, nothing has been done. The good side of this is that if you think these resolutions are a good thing, you should have no problem getting them passed. They are meaningless so why wouldn't your Fiscal Court pass one.

We would be much better off taking this momentum and using it to pass an enhanced preemption law, but surprisingly the people involved in this sanctuary movement are of the opinion that preemption is an antigun tactic that prevents their county from protecting them from state gun control laws.
 
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