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Secession madness! Now 40 states join petition fray

acmariner99

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Feb 12, 2010
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655
Location
Renton, Wa
Looks like people have called you out david. You speak of tolerance and wanting equal rights, but you want to stomp on anyone who has a different opinion or belief system than you. Investigations and deprivation of citizenship for exercising a constitutional right??? While I think secession is extreme - We the People have a Constitutional RIGHT to petition our government and tell them that we are unhappy with the direction they are taking the rest of us. We have the RIGHT to protest. And we have the RIGHT to have different beliefs and exercise them accordingly. We are free to choose our personal associations - we are NOT free to force those beliefs on others. I don't mind if a friend of colleague has a personal aversion to firearms. I do mind when they force me to change my lifestyle to accommodate their aversions. You - David - would throw an absolute fit if I or anyone else forced you to change your beliefs or lifestyle because of your openly gay stance, yet you chastise and threaten anyone who exercises their Constitutional rights to support something you do not personally agree with. Tolerance?? You sir, are have absolutely no understanding of the word.
 

david.ross

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May 24, 2008
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Pittsburgh, PA, USA
You most surely did show up.

When you arrive in Hades at the end of your days, say hello to Hitler.

> implying I'm a Nazi

If I'm a Nazi, then everyone who wants to secede is an ex-confederate KKK member and racist. KKK was born from the confederate army after they lost the war.

> implying there's an afterlife

nope.jpg
 
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Hef

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2007
Messages
524
Location
Bluffton, South Carolina, USA
> implying I'm a Nazi

If I'm a Nazi, then everyone who wants to secede is an ex-confederate KKK member and racist. KKK was born from the confederate army after they lost the war.

> implying there's an afterlife

View attachment 9582

The KKK was born from and historically acted as an agent of the Democratic Party. We are trying to rid ourselves of you Democratic nitwits, so you can keep your KKK, along with your Black Panthers. We don't need any of you. You've done enough damage.
 

sudden valley gunner

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Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
> implying I'm a Nazi

If I'm a Nazi, then everyone who wants to secede is an ex-confederate KKK member and racist. KKK was born from the confederate army after they lost the war.

> implying there's an afterlife

View attachment 9582


Nazi or not you reach for so many of the same goals and laud so many of the same methods. They were a socialist party after all.
 

Citizen

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Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,269
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
Looks like people have called you out david. You speak of tolerance and wanting equal rights, but you want to stomp on anyone who has a different opinion or belief system than you. Investigations and deprivation of citizenship for exercising a constitutional right??? While I think secession is extreme - We the People have a Constitutional RIGHT to petition our government and tell them that we are unhappy with the direction they are taking the rest of us. We have the RIGHT to protest. And we have the RIGHT to have different beliefs and exercise them accordingly. We are free to choose our personal associations - we are NOT free to force those beliefs on others. I don't mind if a friend of colleague has a personal aversion to firearms. I do mind when they force me to change my lifestyle to accommodate their aversions. You - David - would throw an absolute fit if I or anyone else forced you to change your beliefs or lifestyle because of your openly gay stance, yet you chastise and threaten anyone who exercises their Constitutional rights to support something you do not personally agree with. Tolerance?? You sir, are have absolutely no understanding of the word.

"If there be any among us who would wish to dissolve this Union..let them stand undisturbed as monuments of the safety with which error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
Thomas Jefferson. First Inaugural Address.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/jefinau1.asp
 
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Jeff. State

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Aug 29, 2012
Messages
650
Location
usa
> implying I'm a Nazi

If I'm a Nazi, then everyone who wants to secede is an ex-confederate KKK member and racist. KKK was born from the confederate army after they lost the war.


I know States RIGHTS and Individual FREEDOM must be a foreign concept to you, but those ideals are exactly the reason for a Modern secession movement as was the case in 1861. Lincoln enslaved half this nation while claiming to free others.

Millions of "racists" voted in this last election, and they openly admitted the ONLY reason they were voting for their candidate was based on the color of his skin. That candidate was Obama.


Your intolerance of opposing views is the stuff Genocidal tyrranies are made of.
"Dont agree with me, GET RID OF THEM" You have said as much.

You are a Complete contradiction to YOURSELF, carefully read your sigline and what you spout in your posts, it is "openly" clear:dude:.
 
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Jeff. State

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Messages
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usa
Someone I think should have become President this last election and in 2008 as well sums it up well.

Ron Paul

Secession: Are We Free To Go?


Is all the recent talk of secession mere sour grapes over the election, or perhaps something deeper? Currently there are active petitions in support of secession for all 50 states, with Texas taking the lead in number of signatures. Texas has well over the number of signatures needed to generate a response from the administration, and while I wouldn't hold my breath on Texas actually seceding, I believe these petitions raise a lot of worthwhile questions about the nature of our union.

Is it treasonous to want to secede from the United States? Many think the question of secession was settled by our Civil War. On the contrary; the principles of self-governance and voluntary association are at the core of our founding. Clearly Thomas Jefferson believed secession was proper, albeit as a last resort. Writing to William Giles in 1825, he concluded that states:

"should separate from our companions only when the sole alternatives left, are the dissolution of our Union with them, or submission to a government without limitation of powers."

Keep in mind that the first and third paragraphs of the Declaration of Independence expressly contemplate the dissolution of a political union when the underlying government becomes tyrannical.

Do we have a "government without limitation of powers" yet? The Federal government kept the Union together through violence and force in the Civil War, but did might really make right?

Secession is a deeply American principle. This country was born through secession. Some felt it was treasonous to secede from England, but those "traitors" became our country's greatest patriots.

There is nothing treasonous or unpatriotic about wanting a federal government that is more responsive to the people it represents. That is what our Revolutionary War was all about and today our own federal government is vastly overstepping its constitutional bounds with no signs of reform. In fact, the recent election only further entrenched the status quo. If the possibility of secession is completely off the table there is nothing to stop the federal government from continuing to encroach on our liberties and no recourse for those who are sick and tired of it.

Consider the ballot measures that passed in Colorado and Washington state regarding marijuana laws. The people in those states have clearly indicated that they are ready to try something different where drug policy is concerned, yet they will still face a tremendous threat from the federal government. In California, the Feds have been arresting peaceful medical marijuana users and raiding dispensaries that state and local governments have sanctioned. This shouldn't happen in a free country.

It remains to be seen what will happen in states that are refusing to comply with the deeply unpopular mandates of Obamacare by not setting up healthcare exchanges. It appears the Federal government will not respect those decisions either.

In a free country, governments derive their power from the consent of the governed. When the people have very clearly withdrawn their consent for a law, the discussion should be over. If the Feds refuse to accept that and continue to run roughshod over the people, at what point do we acknowledge that that is not freedom anymore? At what point should the people dissolve the political bands which have connected them with an increasingly tyrannical and oppressive federal government? And if people or states are not free to leave the United States as a last resort, can they really think of themselves as free?

If a people cannot secede from an oppressive government, they cannot truly be considered free.
 

W5DVCEXTRA

New member
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Messages
6
Location
BEAUMONT , TEXAS
Texas secession

I think that they are not talking about leaving the union using unlawful methods....if one were to use lawful methods, the feds would do nothing.

If I recall, only Texas can break away without a vote in federal jurisdiction. All that Texas needs is the vote of Texans.

All others would need votes from all over the country to leave. Not impossible but highly improbable. But even if one did wish to leave illegally, no civil war would occur. The world is smaller now and relatives are scattered all over ... nobody is going to want to shoot their brother. If the state votes internally to leave, the other states would say "awww, thats too bad".

TEXAS .........................was an INDEPENDENT REPUBLIC .............before it became a state .
 

Anonymouse

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
210
Location
Virginia
Texas was only a republic for a short while.

It's been occupied more than its been free.

No state could stand on its own. This is all nonsense.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
 

sudden valley gunner

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Whatcom County
New York, Virginia and Rhode Island made the right of secession part of their ratification. No vote of other states needed, constitutionally one state can't have a right another state doesn't have. There is also the mere fact that there would be no United States, if the right of secession wasn't recognized.

Then there are the principle of 98 drafted by Jefferson when Kentucky was admitted.
 

sudden valley gunner

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Texas was only a republic for a short while.

It's been occupied more than its been free.

No state could stand on its own. This is all nonsense.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

Might doesn't make right.
I think it's nonsense simply because the way folks are doing it will reflect no serious change. Secession must come from state legislature not petitions from people that can just be written of as "extremist"
The powers to nullify or put checks on the train of tyranny and central control has eroded greatly over the years, this is just a sign that people are getting a little fed up with not having control over their own destinies.
Why cant a country/state stand on its own? The Federal government gives no money to a state it hasn't stolen in the first place.
 

Anonymouse

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Nov 16, 2012
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210
Location
Virginia
Might doesn't make right.
I think it's nonsense simply because the way folks are doing it will reflect no serious change. Secession must come from state legislature not petitions from people that can just be written of as "extremist"
The powers to nullify or put checks on the train of tyranny and central control has eroded greatly over the years, this is just a sign that people are getting a little fed up with not having control over their own destinies.
Why cant a country/state stand on its own? The Federal government gives no money to a state it hasn't stolen in the first place.

I should have explained more deeply what I meant.

Any state that follows their proper procedure and secedes or rather attempts to secede will get smacked down. Even if the feds allowed it I can already see the economic and political sanctions.

No travel to say Washington. No trade with Washington. Naval ships blocking the coast.

That's just if they are being friendly. If they aren't in that mood they'll just declare martial law or some emergency, mobilize the military after overturning posse comitatus (sp) and roll through the state unseating or killing everyone they consider to be a conspirator. How well has Cuba done with the US blocking it politically and economically.

Secession is a silly argument. Does anyone really believe that the feds would react any differently then they did the first time a state tried to secede in the 1800s.

I don't think its right but its not gonna happen.

Especially when it is malcontents that want to secede merely because Obama won. They won't even have public opinion on their side.

Anything worth seceding over now existed 12 years ago and 20 and so on.

That's why I think its nonsense. At best its an empty threat due to frustration. There has got to be more effective actions than asking the government permission.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
 
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sudden valley gunner

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Whatcom County
I should have explained more deeply what I meant.

Any state that follows their proper procedure and secedes or rather attempts to secede will get smacked down. Even if the feds allowed it I can already see the economic and political sanctions.

No travel to say Washington. No trade with Washington. Naval ships blocking the coast.

That's just if they are being friendly. If they aren't in that mood they'll just declare martial law or some emergency, mobilize the military after overturning posse comitatus (sp) and roll through the state unseating or killing everyone they consider to be a conspirator.

Secession is a silly argument. Dies anyone believe that the feds would react any differently then they did the first time a state tried to secede in the 1800s.

I don't think its right but its not gonna happen.

Especially when it is malcontents that want to secede merely because Obama won. They won't even have public opinion on their side.

Anything worth seceding over existed 12 years ago and 20 and so on.

That's why I think its nonsense.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

Thank you for the clarification, I agree with most of what you said.

You are right the empire won't allow it just like it didn't the first time.

I didn't think of naval blockaide, there would be a lot of border to protect from Canada too.

I personally think the new Red Dawn movie should have been about our own government invading states.
 

Anonymouse

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Virginia
Thank you for the clarification, I agree with most of what you said.

You are right the empire won't allow it just like it didn't the first time.

I didn't think of naval blockaide, there would be a lot of border to protect from Canada too.

I personally think the new Red Dawn movie should have been about our own government invading states.

It's funny. Until I typed that I never really thought of the feds as an empire.

Holy **** I can hear the Imperial March playing in my head.

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sudden valley gunner

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It's funny. Until I typed that I never really thought of the feds as an empire.

Holy **** I can hear the Imperial March playing in my head.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

If it smells like..... and looks like.....the chances are its......

Damnit now I got the Imperial March in my head....Duh Duh duhduh Duh duhduh.....;)
 

Anonymouse

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Virginia
If it smells like..... and looks like.....the chances are its......

Damnit now I got the Imperial March in my head....Duh Duh duhduh Duh duhduh.....;)

I'm not really scared like some people here but if I ever see soldiers marching to the Imperial Death March I'm either reenlisting or bugging out to Costa Rica.

Not sure which yet lol.

;)

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OC for ME

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White Oak Plantation
There is nothing in the founding documents, or current federal law, that requires the United States to have 50 states. The "secession movement" should focus their efforts on their respective state legislatures. This in turn would influence the congressional delegation of that state. Remember, congress critters and their state level counterparts like the perks of elected office.

If secession movement members were to vote into state office citizens of a like mind Washington would only have two options, one of those options involves violent and overwhelming physical force, which, by the way, would likely please david.ross to no end. The other option would be a congress full of critters that would actually work towards the ends of those who elected them into office, which, by the way, would not likely please david.ross to no end.

david.ross, based on his comments posted in this thread, is one of the citizens who did not vote Santa Clause and his elves out of office. david.ross exercised his rights as he saw fit, peacefully and lawfully it appears. He has also realized the results he seeks.....Santa and his elves remain in office.
 

Citizen

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Fairfax Co., VA
If it smells like..... and looks like.....the chances are its......

Damnit now I got the Imperial March in my head....Duh Duh duhduh Duh duhduh.....;)

Hey! Maybe that's the way to avoid Godwin's Law--invoke Chancellor Palpatine!

I'll bet Terry McAuliffe is the Sith Lord; and Karl Rove is his apprentice. Or, maybe I have that backwards. :)
 
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