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Protective & Restraining Orders

NickNt

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Jan 20, 2010
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What is the deal with these exactly? Anyone can get a protective order out on someone, wives do it all the time to their husbands when they are filing for divorce. My question is.....If someone was subject to a protective order (Which lasts until there is a hearing within 2 weeks I believe) or subject to a restraining order, but the order/s have been removed, then does that mean that person is no longer eligible to get a pistol permit? I don't see why they would really need to ask that question on on the pistol permit application. I can see if they asked if there was a CURRENT order out on them, but not a PAST one. If anyone here with any knowledge of all this knows anything please reply. Thank you and have a nice day.
 

brk913

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2007
Messages
370
Location
Plainville, CT
I am sure Kix will be here soon to clarify but I believe the RO has to be currently in force to receive an automatic denial. As far as asking on the application it seems they just want to know about it, sort of like your arrest record, if it's not an automatic disqualifier they just want to be aware of it and maybe discuss it with you...of course with suitability in our statute you just never know...
 

KIX

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Jun 4, 2010
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You will be revoked and/or denied if you have a restraining order - which isn't right.

I'm researching the changes to the law that took effect last year. Seems a business opportunity for FFLs was created as well. I still need to read more up on it. You can no longer just give your guns to a friend who has a permit. They need to be turned in to a PD or an FFL.

I don't know who has gone that route over the FFL route. Still looking for more info as many departments seem to not even know that this is an option.

If an FFL charges a reasonable fee, this could be good for gun owners only in the respect that PD's tend to "lose" firearms or send them for destruction.

The restraining order is very unfair. Unfortunately, there seems to be no repercussion for those that file for them under false pretenses.

Still doing more research on the issue.

Jonathan
 

brk913

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2007
Messages
370
Location
Plainville, CT
I am wondering about past ROs, what if someone had one taken out on them several years ago and it has long since expired. What happens to a new applicant who writes this info on their application, are they usually denied? If they have been "clean" for a few years and faced no criminal charges when the RO was taken out is it even considered? I actually have a student going through this right now. About 8 years ago their girlfriend took out a RO on them, she said he threatened her with a shotgun. He did not even own a shotgun and was never arrested for any criminal charges but he is leary of putting this information on his application. I told him not to lie as they would probably see it during the background check but I was not sure. I also do not know if this was temporary order or if he went to court and it was turned into a "permanent" order by a Judge.
 

JeepinMaxx

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2011
Messages
21
Location
Columbia, CT
I have no horse in this race, but I'm curiousin CT if someone one is under a restraining order (which there is no legal hearing/court appearance etc...) can they show up and confiscate your guns?
 
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brk913

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2007
Messages
370
Location
Plainville, CT
I have no horse in this race, but I'm curiousin CT if someone one is under a restraining order (which there is no legal hearing/court appearance etc...) can they show up and confiscate your guns?

Yes, happened to several people I know...
 

JeepinMaxx

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2011
Messages
21
Location
Columbia, CT
So - if you have a restraining order against you- which you have no control - can be issued with no due process or hearing - can cause an issue in getting a permit...
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,169
Location
earth's crust
A simple objection to this question should suffice .... because you need a permit to practice and practicing is part of the gun (in essence) .. so unless a court order prohibits your gun ownership rights, then the court order is not relevant; and only relevant information is allowed to be considered by the board under Chapter 54 of our statues.

Why people answer every question put to them is a mystery...I guess folks just think they have to complete a form provided to them. One can object to any inquiry put to them and let the facts and law guide the final decision regarding the objection.

Most of the questions on the DPS form and/or board's questionnaire are simply not relevant to the investigation of your right to obtain a permit.
 

davidmcbeth

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Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,169
Location
earth's crust
You will be revoked and/or denied if you have a restraining order - which isn't right.


Jonathan

100% correct -- a RO usually has no effect on your gun rights ... the question of "suitability" has been the subject of several court cases ... subjective, non-quantitative measurements have been found to be unconstitutional.

In CT, old law has stated that the license is like a liquor license and this allows subjective requirements; but these rulings are now garbage IMO....still waiting for a CT court case.

The "suitability" statue really is still valid; however, its current interpretation by our CT courts is flawed. Even the board has indicated this is so in my current case before the board. This case is not yet resolved so this is just a preliminary assessment.
 

emsjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2008
Messages
210
Location
NY-CT
Yes, happened to several people I know...

Better than being charged with a felony for having them in violation of the order I guess...

The forms are interesting, the firearms surrender option has a check box next to it...it looks discretionary, but the forms come pre-printed with the box checked.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,169
Location
earth's crust
What is the deal with these exactly? Anyone can get a protective order out on someone, wives do it all the time to their husbands when they are filing for divorce. My question is.....If someone was subject to a protective order (Which lasts until there is a hearing within 2 weeks I believe) or subject to a restraining order, but the order/s have been removed, then does that mean that person is no longer eligible to get a pistol permit? I don't see why they would really need to ask that question on on the pistol permit application. I can see if they asked if there was a CURRENT order out on them, but not a PAST one. If anyone here with any knowledge of all this knows anything please reply. Thank you and have a nice day.

I objected to this question with my permit application (along with all other questions) .. and the board has, so far, granted all my objections.

wish to discuss further pm me.
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,169
Location
earth's crust
So - if you have a restraining order against you- which you have no control - can be issued with no due process or hearing - can cause an issue in getting a permit...

Well, they'll get an ex-parte order first and then a hearing on the order is needed afterwards.
 

JeepinMaxx

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2011
Messages
21
Location
Columbia, CT
Well, they'll get an ex-parte order first and then a hearing on the order is needed afterwards.

So- if someone one is under a restraining order (which there is no legal hearing/court appearance etc...) can they show up and confiscate your guns?

Is that still true with regards to the 4th (unlawful search and seizure) in CT?

Restraining Orders have no due process in CT - I just don't understand how they can have an effect on individuals rights
 

Tanner

Regular Member
Joined
May 10, 2012
Messages
474
Location
Chesterfield, Virginia, United States
isent life grand

Been there doing that. I had not yet been served the RO (which would have had to been filed under false pretences). Went to the local magistrate and this is what was explained to me. If you currently have a CHP it is no longer valid. You may not be in possession of any firearm during the time that the RO is in effect. Once said RO is no longer valid (expired) if it is a temporary RO (like mine) then your gun rights are restored. A RO is NOT enforceable until you have been served. Typically the police serve you but there are other ways to be served. Also according to the magistrate the RO will only show up on background checks while it is active (not expired). If you are dealing with a perminent RO the story is different and I dident really speak with her about them.

From the reaserch I have done so far there are usually two hearings in dealing with a RO. The first being a ex parte hearing. Ex parte is a Latin phrase meaning "on one side only" so guess what.... Your probably not going to be present during that hearing, although it is not unheard of. Most likely you wont even know about the hearing though. Then there is the full hearing. This is your time to shine. Gather evidence if you can, tell your story, and good luck. A lawyer is not a bad idea either. If either you or the one who got the RO does not appear in court the judgment usually goes in the favor of the one who showed up to court so keep that in mind as well. And last but not least depending on the situation a temporary RO can be revised into a perminent RO.

I will disclaim that these statements are based off of personal research and a conversation with a local magistrate in the state of VA and should not be misconsrtued as fact or legal advice. Good luck I know I will need it.
 

emsjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2008
Messages
210
Location
NY-CT
Been there doing that. I had not yet been served the RO (which would have had to been filed under false pretences). Went to the local magistrate and this is what was explained to me. If you currently have a CHP it is no longer valid. You may not be in possession of any firearm during the time that the RO is in effect. Once said RO is no longer valid (expired) if it is a temporary RO (like mine) then your gun rights are restored. A RO is NOT enforceable until you have been served. Typically the police serve you but there are other ways to be served. Also according to the magistrate the RO will only show up on background checks while it is active (not expired). If you are dealing with a perminent RO the story is different and I dident really speak with her about them.

From the reaserch I have done so far there are usually two hearings in dealing with a RO. The first being a ex parte hearing. Ex parte is a Latin phrase meaning "on one side only" so guess what.... Your probably not going to be present during that hearing, although it is not unheard of. Most likely you wont even know about the hearing though. Then there is the full hearing. This is your time to shine. Gather evidence if you can, tell your story, and good luck. A lawyer is not a bad idea either. If either you or the one who got the RO does not appear in court the judgment usually goes in the favor of the one who showed up to court so keep that in mind as well. And last but not least depending on the situation a temporary RO can be revised into a perminent RO.

I will disclaim that these statements are based off of personal research and a conversation with a local magistrate in the state of VA and should not be misconsrtued as fact or legal advice. Good luck I know I will need it.

What you would be looking for in CT is called a Fernando hearing to challenge the order. It doesn't take much to get a PO issued and you won't have much of an opportunity...if any at all at the hearing in which the order is issued. In the meantime you will have 48 hours to get the guns out of your possession or face a felony. IANAL
 
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Tanner

Regular Member
Joined
May 10, 2012
Messages
474
Location
Chesterfield, Virginia, United States
What you would be looking for in CT is called a Fernando hearing to challenge the order. It doesn't take much to get a PO issued and you won't have much of an opportunity...if any at all at the hearing in which the order is issued. In the meantime you will have 48 hours to get the guns out of your possession or face a felony. IANAL

I have still not been served the papers and said RO has since expired. WTF. Went ahead and got rid of the guns anyways during the RO. It was a 72 hour emergency RO and from what I can tell there are not usually court dates for those. Still researching though
 

emsjeep

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2008
Messages
210
Location
NY-CT
I have still not been served the papers and said RO has since expired. WTF. Went ahead and got rid of the guns anyways during the RO. It was a 72 hour emergency RO and from what I can tell there are not usually court dates for those. Still researching though

Yeah, I don't know what Virginia does, but here the ex parte order is good for up to 14 days and requires a hearing at that time or before it. As there is a hearing, notice is required. Maybe the police have some ability to issue a temp order after a family violence incident?
 

Tanner

Regular Member
Joined
May 10, 2012
Messages
474
Location
Chesterfield, Virginia, United States
Yeah, I don't know what Virginia does, but here the ex parte order is good for up to 14 days and requires a hearing at that time or before it. As there is a hearing, notice is required. Maybe the police have some ability to issue a temp order after a family violence incident?

Here a magistrate can process something called a emergency RO. So far my research has come up that there are not typically court dates for these, And the emergency RO is only valid for 72 hours. And the rules still apply while the emergency RO is active. So no gun possession is allowed!
Still OC related!
 
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