• We are now running on a new, and hopefully much-improved, server. In addition we are also on new forum software. Any move entails a lot of technical details and I suspect we will encounter a few issues as the new server goes live. Please be patient with us. It will be worth it! :) Please help by posting all issues here.
  • The forum will be down for about an hour this weekend for maintenance. I apologize for the inconvenience.
  • If you are having trouble seeing the forum then you may need to clear your browser's DNS cache. Click here for instructions on how to do that
  • Please review the Forum Rules frequently as we are constantly trying to improve the forum for our members and visitors.

Guns SKY-ROCKETING at Florida State Fair!

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
quote: the fact is, bringing your firearm to a state or local fair has been legal in most states for many years. unquote

such misinformation phil:

1. New Mexico
4.3.1.19 DEADLY WEAPONS PROHIBITED:A. No person shall enter the New Mexico state fairgrounds bearing or otherwise possessing any deadly weapon, whether concealed or not.

2. North Carolina
Agriculture Commissioner Steve Troxler has stated that firearms, even those carried pursuant to a concealed carry permit, will be prohibited at the North Carolina State Fair... https://nccriminallaw.sog.unc.edu/guns-at-the-state-fair/

3. Virigina
The State Fair prohibits weapons of any kind from entering the property, including pocket knives. We ask that guests leave those items in their vehicles before purchasing their tickets. https://www.statefairva.org/p.aspx?pID=about/272&

4. Georgia
Can I bring a gun into the fair if I have a carrying permit?
NO. Only on-duty and off-duty law enforcement officers are allowed to bring in a gun https://www.georgiastatefair.org/faq

5. Tennessee
No firearms or other weapons are allowed, regardless of whether bearer holds a concealed weapons permit. http://tnstatefair.org/about-the-fair/code-of-conduct

6. Louisanna
No firearms or other weapons are allowed, regardless of whether bearer holds a concealed weapons permit; https://www.statefairoflouisiana.com/p/guest-info/202

7. Minnesota
No weapons of any sort will be allowed on the fairgrounds, http://www.startribune.com/state-fair-tightening-security-at-gates-elsewhere-for-2016/390307891/

8. Indiana
No person in possession of a deadly weapon shall be permitted onto or be permitted to remain on the Fairgrounds; http://www.indianastatefair.com/state-fair/general-information/guest-services/

9. Texas
No weapons of any kind. https://bigtex.com/info/faq/

kinda begs the question Phil: why are you promoting and pushing BS information contributing to the fake news crap to this nation's citizens which has the potential of getting our readers in trouble and the other crap you put out on your 'blog'!

You didn't even check your information since it took me five minutes to come up with nine states which prohibit firearms at their state fairs which contradicts your opening statement...most!

you should be ashamed of yourself for not being responsible in promoting factual information instead of fake news cuz you didn't want to take the time to do thorough research...

added:

quarter to a dollar as you flaunt the state fair carry in everyone's faces the FL legislature will ban firearms !!
 
Last edited:

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,126
Location
White Oak Plantation
If there are state statutes/county ordinances that specifically make it a criminal offense to bear arms vs. being trespassed for bearing arms at a state/county fair then "BS newspeak" is a accurate descriptor. If there are no state statutes/county ordinances then the general assertion made by the OP in his blog is not inaccurate. We are often reminding government drones that state preemption laws must be followed. The loophole of "private event" is often used by liberals to infringe upon our natural rights.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
If there are state statutes/county ordinances that specifically make it a criminal offense to bear arms vs. being trespassed for bearing arms at a state/county fair then "BS newspeak" is a accurate descriptor. If there are no state statutes/county ordinances then the general assertion made by the OP in his blog is not inaccurate. We are often reminding government drones that state preemption laws must be followed. The loophole of "private event" is often used by liberals to infringe upon our natural rights.

IF, key word IF, a citizen is denied their constitutional privilege or legal right as granted by a state granted permit/license to carry their firearms openly or concealed... as the nine states i listed show their citizens are prohibited to carry firearms at their state fairs ~ period.

I do not care of the rationale, e.g., statutory mandates or cuz we have always done it this way, or in NC's case the AG Director Troxel has a wild hair and unilaterally ban firearms w/o statutory authority and even the good folk at NC's premier GRNC won't pursue legal action so the citizens in NC and the other states listed are denied their firearms at there state fair...

therefore, the OP's statement as i quoted: the fact is, bringing your firearm to a state or local fair has been legal in most states for many years. unquote; shows author Phil didn't do one iota of research to check before making the false news statement and regales their article as nothing but BS newspeek.

just saying...
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
12,126
Location
White Oak Plantation
If you do not care if statutory authority exists, then there is no point in continuing this discussion. Either these state/county fair organizers will be compelled, by liberty seeking citizens, to follow state law (preemption statutes) or they will not be compelled and the OP carping about the current situation, regardless of the state in question, is nothing more than carping.

The AG of NC could be voted out of office, recalled if permitted under the state's constitution or laws, and then elect a AG who will compel the state/county fair organizers to follow state law (preemption if it exists) or be held in legal/civil peril.

Expecting overnight corrective action is folly. Work to have your state enforce their own laws on other state/county agencies/organizations...public land is public land after all. If we do not vote your displeasure with your wallet.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,337
Location
Valhalla
--snipped--

3. Virigina
The State Fair prohibits weapons of any kind from entering the property, including pocket knives. We ask that guests leave those items in their vehicles before purchasing their tickets. https://www.statefairva.org/p.aspx?pID=about/272&
Virginia State Fair is owned by non-governmental entity and on private property. As such they can make their own rules.

"The State Fair of Virginia is a state fair held annually at the end of September at The Meadow Event Park in Caroline County, Virginia. Through 2008, the fair was held at the Richmond Raceway Complex, located in eastern Henrico County, just outside the capital city of Richmond. It is owned by the Virginia Farm Bureau Federation."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Fair_of_Virginia
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
If you do not care if statutory authority exists, then there is no point in continuing this discussion. Either these state/county fair organizers will be compelled, by liberty seeking citizens, to follow state law (preemption statutes) or they will not be compelled and the OP carping about the current situation, regardless of the state in question, is nothing more than carping.

The AG of NC could be voted out of office, recalled if permitted under the state's constitution or laws, and then elect a AG who will compel the state/county fair organizers to follow state law (preemption if it exists) or be held in legal/civil peril.

Expecting overnight corrective action is folly. Work to have your state enforce their own laws on other state/county agencies/organizations...public land is public land after all. If we do not vote your displeasure with your wallet.
allow me quantify, remember my original post was in reference to Phil’s statement, “it is a fact”...”have been legal in “most”....

i pointed out nine states which “do not allow” and then you brought up your commentary re rationale being forbidden might/could be due to private event, etc.

my statement of “do not care why firearm(s) are prohibited”, is directed strictly towards phil’s article to dispel his fake news bs regarding most allow ~ for years crap!

now, to address your recent statment regarding further discussion...
in the Tarheel state we have an august entity, GRNC, who professes to have passed state firearms statutes and stands for the sober, law biding, concealed carrying citizens of this state ~ as anticipated, they couldn’t do crap to get troxel off his pagan horse as he stoodfast to his proclamation of no firearms at his state fair! http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/counties/wake-county/article17235584.html

if you check, there was more than enough chatter on the NC sub thread of ways discussed on overturning the appointed troxel but it was for naught!

NM’s is statutory, TX, GA, ad nauesam, are those state citizens problem.

now a quick check of WA they also ban firearms (so now 10 states or 20% do not allow firearms at their state fairs) but in the recent past this member specifically asked WA forum membership who to send emails to about protesting another fire initiative and i was told “we don’t want your help!
 
Last edited:

phil1979

Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2011
Messages
83
Location
Atlanta, GA
For Solus' Benefit

I should have been more specific, fairs held on PUBLIC property have been legal in most states for years. And even in some states where private property fairs ban weapons, it is not illegal per se to carry there - you just have to leave if told.

The one link Solus provided for Georgia is a link to fair held on PRIVATE property.
 

phil1979

Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2011
Messages
83
Location
Atlanta, GA
Well stated, sir!

I don't know why I seem to get under solus' skin, LOL!

When I took him to task over his unjustified criticisms of my other article, he didn't have another peep to make about it.

Am I wearing a "troll me" sign here? :)


If there are state statutes/county ordinances that specifically make it a criminal offense to bear arms vs. being trespassed for bearing arms at a state/county fair then "BS newspeak" is a accurate descriptor. If there are no state statutes/county ordinances then the general assertion made by the OP in his blog is not inaccurate. We are often reminding government drones that state preemption laws must be followed. The loophole of "private event" is often used by liberals to infringe upon our natural rights.
 

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,697
Location
Granite State of Mind
quote: the fact is, bringing your firearm to a state or local fair has been legal in most states for many years. unquote

such misinformation phil:


9. Texas
No weapons of any kind. https://bigtex.com/info/faq/
Speaking of misinformation, you stopped reading too soon.

License to Carry a Handgun
A person holding a valid Texas License to Carry a Handgun (LTC), or a valid concealed handgun license from a reciprocating state, is permitted to enter the Fair with his or her concealed handgun, provided that he or she thereafter fully complies with all applicable laws. LTC holders are responsible for knowing and complying with all applicable Texas laws. For example, under Texas Penal Code Section 46.035 a LTC holder is prohibited from carrying a concealed handgun (1) inside Cotton Bowl Stadium or on any other premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, (2) on the premises of a business that derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, or (3) while intoxicated.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
Speaking of misinformation, you stopped reading too soon.

License to Carry a Handgun
A person holding a valid Texas License to Carry a Handgun (LTC), or a valid concealed handgun license from a reciprocating state, is permitted to enter the Fair with his or her concealed handgun, provided that he or she thereafter fully complies with all applicable laws. LTC holders are responsible for knowing and complying with all applicable Texas laws. For example, under Texas Penal Code Section 46.035 a LTC holder is prohibited from carrying a concealed handgun (1) inside Cotton Bowl Stadium or on any other premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, (2) on the premises of a business that derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, or (3) while intoxicated.
KBCraig, i am truly sorry you didn't click on the 2018 Texas' state fair cite i listed with my quote from that site. Therefore, please allow me to reiterate the cite, https://bigtex.com/info/faq/ as well as the entire statement from the Lone Star's state fair site: quote:

What items are NOT allowed in the State Fair of Texas?
No weapons of any kind.Please help us keep the Fair safe and fun for all! We reserve the right to search all fairgoers and their bags upon entry into the fairgrounds. No weapons of any kind are permitted on the fairgrounds. This includes guns, knives, clubs, tasers, etc. Also, all sharp metal objects, such as pocket knives, scissors, and other sharp implements, are strictly prohibited. Please leave these items at home or in your vehicle. If you usually carry a pocket knife and forget it’s in your pocket when you reach the security checkpoint, you will be asked to return it to your vehicle to secure your knife or be given the option to dispose of it prior to entering the park. If you question whether something is safe to bring in, it probably isn’t – and should be left at home or in the vehicle. unquote.

speaking of cites, was we are...where did you pull yours from? oh ya you got it from congoharry's 5 Oct 2016 post on the Texas & US Law Shield gun forum https://forum.texaslawshield.com/index.php?topic=2302.0

BTW KBCraig, if you click on congoharry's cite in his post you are taken to the 2018 state fair site which unequivocally states...NO GUNs

misinformation...yes you have produced further confusion w/o checking your sources.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
I should have been more specific, fairs held on PUBLIC property have been legal in most states for years. And even in some states where private property fairs ban weapons, it is not illegal per se to carry there - you just have to leave if told.

The one link Solus provided for Georgia is a link to fair held on PRIVATE property.
mind reader 1.jpg

I am truly sorry phil, I, and I am sure the other few who tried to read your dribble missed reading into initial BS newspeek statement that they should have had their mind reading skills so they would understand that isn't what you meant as "fact" and "most" as your 'more specific' commentary on the subject you just mentioned.

strange phil, the GA state fair cite i provided does not reference this is the cite for the GA state fair held on 'private' property verses the one held where phil?

oh, did i miss the GA cite you have to show this august body where the 'real' GA state fair allows firearms?

oh Phil, what about the other nine cites provided which show firearms are ban at these state's fairs?
 
Last edited:

phil1979

Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2011
Messages
83
Location
Atlanta, GA
Solus, read my reply again carefully. I was not admitting any factual error. And you need not be a mind reader. I was talking about legality, as in state laws (for states that have some form of state preemption, and most do). Perhaps my being more specific would have assisted a person not able to comprehend that.

Carrying at fairs IS legal in most states, that's a FACT. Some private fairs ban guns but that in itself does not make it ILLEGAL, unless state law says so.

And what cite are you looking for with regard to Georgia law? We have a state law that says carry is legal in all places except those that are specified as off limits per state law, and provided that those in control of private property can ban guns (backed up by the trespass statute only, so carry is legal there unless they tell you to leave and you don't, but even then you'll only be charged with trespass and not a weapons violation).

If you do your research, you will find people who have openly carried (myself included) at various public property fairs in Georgia and other states.

Please come off the caffeine. :)
 

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,697
Location
Granite State of Mind
KBCraig, i am truly sorry you didn't click on the 2018 Texas' state fair cite i listed with my quote from that site. Therefore, please allow me to reiterate the cite, https://bigtex.com/info/faq/ as well as the entire statement from the Lone Star's state fair site: quote:

What items are NOT allowed in the State Fair of Texas?
No weapons of any kind.Please help us keep the Fair safe and fun for all! We reserve the right to search all fairgoers and their bags upon entry into the fairgrounds. No weapons of any kind are permitted on the fairgrounds. This includes guns, knives, clubs, tasers, etc. Also, all sharp metal objects, such as pocket knives, scissors, and other sharp implements, are strictly prohibited. Please leave these items at home or in your vehicle. If you usually carry a pocket knife and forget it’s in your pocket when you reach the security checkpoint, you will be asked to return it to your vehicle to secure your knife or be given the option to dispose of it prior to entering the park. If you question whether something is safe to bring in, it probably isn’t – and should be left at home or in the vehicle. unquote.

speaking of cites, was we are...where did you pull yours from? oh ya you got it from congoharry's 5 Oct 2016 post on the Texas & US Law Shield gun forum https://forum.texaslawshield.com/index.php?topic=2302.0

BTW KBCraig, if you click on congoharry's cite in his post you are taken to the 2018 state fair site which unequivocally states...NO GUNs

misinformation...yes you have produced further confusion w/o checking your sources.
Umm... I clicked on your link. I've never been to that other site you referenced.

From your link, under the "what is not allowed" section:

https://bigtex.com/info/faq/

License to Carry a Handgun
A person holding a valid Texas License to Carry a Handgun (LTC), or a valid concealed handgun license from a reciprocating state, is permitted to enter the Fair with his or her concealed handgun, provided that he or she thereafter fully complies with all applicable laws. LTC holders are responsible for knowing and complying with all applicable Texas laws. For example, under Texas Penal Code Section 46.035 a LTC holder is prohibited from carrying a concealed handgun (1) inside Cotton Bowl Stadium or on any other premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, (2) on the premises of a business that derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, or (3) while intoxicated.

State Fair of Texas prohibits Fair attendees (including LTC holders) from openly carrying handguns while at the Fair. If an individual attempts to enter the Fair with an openly carried handgun, he or she will not be allowed to enter the Fair unless he or she conceals the handgun (if he or she has a valid LTC) or secures the handgun in his or her vehicle or at some offsite location. If an LTC holder enters the Fair with a concealed handgun and then begins to openly carry the handgun, he or she will be asked to either conceal the handgun or to leave the Fair.


...and...

The State Fair of Texas has received inquiries about its decision not to allow open carry of handguns during the Fair and would like to clear up some of the questions that have been raised. It is important to understand that the State Fair of Texas is—and always has been—a private entity. The Fair leases property from the City of Dallas but is not part of the City or controlled by the City. Also, many of you have read or heard recently about a private organization that may begin operating Fair Park as a whole. That is a different organization that is not related to the Fair.

The State Fair of Texas has long been, and continues to be, a strong supporter of the rights of responsible gun owning Texans. For that reason, the Fair has long allowed Fair attendees with concealed handgun licenses to carry their handguns while at the Fair (except for locations prohibited by law).

With the recently enacted open-carry law, the State Fair of Texas considered whether to allow openly carried handguns during the Fair. After carefully considering the issue, the Fair has decided to prohibit open carry, while continuing to allow concealed carry. This decision is consistent with an August 9, 2016 opinion letter issued by Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton, in which the Attorney General confirmed that the law which prohibits the government from banning handguns from most government property (Texas Government Code 411.209) applies only to bans implemented by the government and does not override the rights of a private entity that happens to operate on property leased from the government. In that situation, the private entity is no different than any other business operating on private property.

We know that this is an important issue for many Texans, and that the Fair’s decision may disappoint potential fairgoers who regularly and responsibly practice open carry. However, the Fair strongly believes that allowing concealed carry and prohibiting open carry is a reasonable compromise that best ensures the safety and comfort of all Fair attendees.


Let me know if you'd like a screen shot of the page that you cited, because it clearly says that legally concealed handguns are allowed. That is just as it has always been for the Texas State Fair, because it's the law that they cannot prohibit them.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
kbcraig, et al.,

question...did you find on the Texas state fair cite i originally provided which showed the three explicit statements regarding “no weapons of any kind.” “no weapons....”, “this includes guns....” i quoted?

notice these three explicit statements in the first paragraph under the site’s FAQ major heading “what items are not allowed” and under a subheading, “no weapons of any kind

therefore if a potential citizen get this far...it is pretty clear ~ “NO WEAPONS” are permitted on the property as stated in the subheading.

but the good citizen is not convinced, tunnel vision if you will, so they open the subheading and lo & behold the three explicit statements mentioned above are stated for all to see in the first paragraph!

now you will notice this paragraph with the statements does not contain any, nada, none provisions for any what ifs, or exceptions, or guidance to see below!

now i’m wisen...but i know getting into a verbal contest w/barney fife or rentacop at the hectic entrance after walking through the metal detector about my reading of the rules saying my concealed firearm is allowed and barney’s understanding of his supervisor’s instructions of no weapons of any kind are allowed!

as has been stated numerous time about beating the rap with your day in court but you might miss the fair with your family.

that the great state of texas doesn’t have a proof reader and has conflicting information for their citizens is not my concern!

please make your choice wisely!
 
Last edited:

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,697
Location
Granite State of Mind
It's not a difficult issue. Fair Park is owned by the City of Dallas, and cannot bar legal concealed carry.

You could admit that you were wrong from the clear text at your own cite, or you could just bite your tongue and pretend that you weren't proven wrong.

Or you can write another wall of text claiming that you're still correct.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,337
Location
Valhalla
It's not a difficult issue. Fair Park is owned by the City of Dallas, and cannot bar legal concealed carry.

You could admit that you were wrong from the clear text at your own cite, or you could just bite your tongue and pretend that you weren't proven wrong.

Or you can write another wall of text claiming that you're still correct.
The City of Dallas is not barring any form of carry in this instance. The city has leased to property to a private business. It is this business/venue that is doing the restricting.

Just like when you rent a house, you may restrict/control what goes on there.

If you have information to the contrary, please post it with a link.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
8,229
Location
here nc
It's not a difficult issue. Fair Park is owned by the City of Dallas, and cannot bar legal concealed carry.

You could admit that you were wrong from the clear text at your own cite, or you could just bite your tongue and pretend that you weren't proven wrong.

Or you can write another wall of text claiming that you're still correct.
truly do not understand your consternation over what has been duly cited as well as directly quoted from the Texas State Fair website’s FAQ heading: “what items are not allowed” is the subheading:

no weapons of any kind

this subsection goes on to unreservedly & specifically state:this includes guns and as pointed out previously, there are no caveats, no provisonal exemptions after this statement!

therefore, the state fair management’s intent is quite clear ~ they do not want weapons, firearms included, brought through the gates of their state fair’s private premises!

again, tis not my place to second guess their management’s intent for the appraent extraneous and obviously conflicting material placed on their website!

however, as i have stated numerous times i will avoid, to the extent possible, having to defend myself from on the spot judicial conflict with nice LEs who believe they are right and will do everything in their power to assure i comply to their will until the judge later corrects their actions.

bottom line, i avoid the ride to the hoosegow at all costs!

please, have a good day!

ps: you did see who the author of post 16 was ?
 
Last edited:
Top