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Supreme Court violating law when issuing permits regarding renewals

Sheriff

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
1,968
Location
Virginia, USA
Raise your hands and vote.... how many of you have had the Supreme Court violate the law? I just had my Concealed Handgun Permit renewed and the Circuit Court did the expiration date wrong. The Circuit Court claims the software provided by the Supreme Court is to blame, and they say they can't override the software.

My CHP was set to expire on 7-09-2012. The law states that if I submit my renewal application at least 90 days before the expiration date, and no more than 180 days before the expiration date, the renewal shall be valid for 5 years from the expiration date of the current CHP. Therefore the expiration on my renewed CHP should have been 7-09-2017. But the Supreme Court software kicked the CHP out with an expiration of 5-09-2017.

In other words, the Supreme Court itself has violated the law as written. Cute, eh??
 

peter nap

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Messages
13,551
Location
Valhalla
Personally, I'd be more inclined to believe that the circuit court was blowing smoke up your posterior....

Roscoe

Yep...I call BS from the Clerk.
The easy way to correct it is call the Administrative office of the Supreme court. They oversee the Clerks.
 

Sheriff

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
1,968
Location
Virginia, USA
The clerk is a close personal friend of mine. If there was any way she could override the software and issue my permit with the correct expiration date..... she would have. But the expiration date on the actual permit has to match whatever the computer system spits out, or it could cause some major problems down the road. This is not the first bug they have found in the software, and it won't be the last. It's just something the programmers missed when updating the software with new law changes each year.

I had a choice, accept my permit as the software spit it out, or do without until the programming could be rewritten and corrected. Most people lately probably picked up their permits and never even noticed the expiration date was wrong.
 
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Sheriff

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May 19, 2008
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Virginia, USA
The clerks office doesn't own a typewriter?

Typewriter or no typewriter, the online records would show one expiration date, and the actual paper permit would show something different.

The online system can not be overridden to show the correct expiration date.

If stopped on July 1, 2017 by a cop, I would still be legal. But the system would show I had expired on 5-09-2017 and the cop would probably arrest me.
 
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Tess

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
3,837
Location
Bryan, TX
Typewriter or no typewriter, the online records would show one expiration date, and the actual paper permit would show something different.

The online system can not be overridden to show the correct expiration date.

If stopped on July 1, 2017 by a cop, I would still be legal. But the system would show I had expired on 5-09-2017 and the cop would probably arrest me.

Except that within that time you would have renewed your permit, so though he may make an arrest, making a charge stick would be another thing.

And why would he even be concerned about you if you are simply going about your business. My point is, what is the likelihood of being stopped and required to show a permit IN THAT PERIOD OF TIME when your paper permit shows a different date from the VSP record?
 

DrMark

Lone Star Veteran
Joined
Jan 13, 2007
Messages
1,559
Location
Hampton Roads, Virginia, USA
Raise your hands and vote.... how many of you have had the Supreme Court violate the law? I just had my Concealed Handgun Permit renewed and the Circuit Court did the expiration date wrong. The Circuit Court claims the software provided by the Supreme Court is to blame, and they say they can't override the software.

My CHP was set to expire on 7-09-2012. The law states that if I submit my renewal application at least 90 days before the expiration date, and no more than 180 days before the expiration date, the renewal shall be valid for 5 years from the expiration date of the current CHP. Therefore the expiration on my renewed CHP should have been 7-09-2017. But the Supreme Court software kicked the CHP out with an expiration of 5-09-2017.

In other words, the Supreme Court itself has violated the law as written. Cute, eh??

Interesting.

Last week I submitted my CHP renewal, within the 90-180 day window. I mentioned why I was submitting it then, pointing out that law. The clerk's office seemed to have no awareness of the law, so I'll certainly be checking out the date on the new permit.
 

Sheriff

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
1,968
Location
Virginia, USA
Interesting.

Last week I submitted my CHP renewal, within the 90-180 day window. I mentioned why I was submitting it then, pointing out that law. The clerk's office seemed to have no awareness of the law, so I'll certainly be checking out the date on the new permit.

Please let us know how it works out for you.
 

Wolf_shadow

Activist Member
Joined
Jul 5, 2006
Messages
1,215
Location
Accomac, Virginia, USA
Interesting.

Last week I submitted my CHP renewal, within the 90-180 day window. I mentioned why I was submitting it then, pointing out that law. The clerk's office seemed to have no awareness of the law, so I'll certainly be checking out the date on the new permit.

Please let us know how it works out for you.
Last submited my renewal in 2010 in Accomack County. On submission I was told by deputy clerk that I was submitting too early. I told them of the change in the law, insisted they take the application and process it under the law as written. When I received the new permit wrong date. Took numerous contacts with court clerk and threat of going to high court but it was fixed.:D
 

Sheriff

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
1,968
Location
Virginia, USA
When I received the new permit wrong date. Took numerous contacts with court clerk and threat of going to high court but it was fixed.:D

I would have fought it too. But the clerk is a friend, and I didn't want to make a scene.

I simply lost 2 months on this permit, maybe by 2017 they will have the software fixed.
 

Sheriff

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
1,968
Location
Virginia, USA
Contact your friend on or after your correct renewal date. She should be able to enter the correct date at some point, right? Get her to re-issue it correctly.

The court dockets are kept in the state computer system now. Even a concealed weapon renewal has a case number assigned to it and is part of the court docket. The date the judge signs the renewal is entered into the docket system (in my case 5-09-2012), then the software is giving people a 5 year permit from the date the judge signed it. This is the point, the clerk is not able to override the system and issue the permit with the correct expiration date. At least not until the programmers make the software match the law.
 

user

Accomplished Advocate
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
2,516
Location
Northern Piedmont
The issuance of a CHP is an order of the Circuit Court and you have the right to an "ore tenus" (i.e., holding forth orally) argument in that court. File a motion for the next available motions' day, send a copy to the Commonwealth's Attorney, go to the hearing and tell the judge what happened and why, and ask the judge to order that it be fixed. They can hand-write the correct information on that card and correct the records manually if necessary. Ask your friend, the Clerk, to help you with the form of the motion and "praecipe" or notice of motion, and what the available dates and procedures are.
 
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