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Revive HB 5232 of 2009

jmlefler

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
287
Location
Southwest, Michigan, USA
In 2009, HB 5232 was introduced in the Michigan State Legislature. This bill is similar to the bill passed in Wyoming; it protects Michigan citizens from Federal interference of gun commerce originating within the State. Wyoming has gone on and reintroduced a bill to include 'owners', thus protecting not only commerce but its citizens as well.

Please contact your legislators re: re-introduction.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(xx...g.aspx?page=getobject&objectname=2009-hb-5232

Carry on.

J
 

DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
Can we get confirmations from Michigan gun organizations that they will not allow criminalization of OC in PFZ's, or any other anti gun-rights compromises, in order to get this legislation passed?

I am quite seriously asking for this. I am not being facetious.
 

TheQ

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2010
Messages
3,379
Location
Lansing, Michigan
Can we get confirmations from Michigan gun organizations that they will not allow criminalization of OC in PFZ's, or any other anti gun-rights compromises, in order to get this legislation passed?

I am quite seriously asking for this. I am not being facetious.

Can we get a commitment from you to not duplicate posts?
 

DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
Can we get a commitment from you to not duplicate posts?

The question is the same, but it is relevant to each new proposed legislation since Michigan gun organizations established that they may compromise OC to get proposals passed.

So, while my question is the same, it certainly is a very relevant question to get an answer on for each proposal, right?
 
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Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
The question is the same, but it is relevant to each new proposed legislation since Michigan gun organizations established that they may compromise OC to get proposals passed.

So, while my question is the same, it certainly is a very relevant question to get an answer on for each proposal, right?

Ease up, gentlemen.
 

DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
Ease up, gentlemen.

SB, such feedback does not distinguish whether or not I am approaching being sanctioned for my posts. I'm sincerely interested in knowing if any of my posts are nearly grounds for deletion or having the thread closed. I would prefer you quote exactly what I wrote and point out the offense I'm potentially headed for. It is important for me to understand, so that I may post my legitimate questions or points in a way that avoids justifiable sanction.
 
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Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
SB, such feedback does not distinguish whether or not I am approaching being sanctioned for my posts. I'm sincerely interested in knowing if any of my posts are nearly grounds for deletion or having the thread closed. I would prefer you quote exactly what I wrote and point out the offense I'm potentially headed for. It is important for me to understand, so that I may post my legitimate questions or points in a way that avoids justifiable sanction.

Notice, I used the plural gentleMEN.....The Q, included.
 

DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
Notice, I used the plural gentleMEN.....The Q, included.

I know. I am wondering what portion of my posts caused you to include me in your admonishment. I don't see anything I've written which need elicit a warning to me from you.

Please leave me out of your moderating unless I, myself, post something objectively needing moderation. That's what I'm asking for: please quote material from me that you believe, from a moderator viewpoint, is not allowable.

I respect this site and I'm here to learn if something I post is not allowable. Please quote my content that you perceive is not allowable.
 

mikestilly

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Messages
1,869
Location
Macomb County, Michigan, USA
Its whatever post I disagree with. Bye bye gone..

joke ;) but then again looking at my sb59 post which was one of many that we're closed to stop debate on it. I'm in the belief this is how Michigan is now moderated? It was closed bringing virtually the same thing Dan is saying today. I still think its quite disgusting that Michigan Open Carry supported a bill that criminalized open carry for the first time ever in Michigan in PFZs. Talk about a bill that contained a specific clause that couldn't be more contrary from what MOCs goals are. This forum is dead in my opinion. It only fosters arguments and fighting. Real discussions and debates on subjects don't happen here thanks to moderation if they disagree with OCDOs views or the moderators. Take a look at the poll that asked weather people agree with the last compromise and who doesn't. It speaks volumes. TheQs constant snarky posts go to show that he is unfit to lead any organization. To say that gun rights orgs are beyond reproach is laughable. It's about open carry and is well on topic. It's not off base to question weather so called gun rights orgs are going to continue supporting anti-open carry legislation. I expect to see it continuing and the fact they are still quiet about it means it's there any they want to minimize the exposure.
 
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DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
I think it's helpful, not to mention on-topic, to just stick to discussion of the revival of HB 5232. Part of that discussion is where the Michigan gun orgs are at with regard to potentially compromising currently legal gun rights for this particular proposed legislation.
 

griffin

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
871
Location
Okemos, MI
This forum is dead in my opinion. It only fosters arguments and fighting. Real discussions and debates on subjects don't happen here thanks to moderation if they disagree with OCDOs views or the moderators.

Can you suggest another forum to openly discuss open carry in Michigan?
 

TheQ

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2010
Messages
3,379
Location
Lansing, Michigan
joke ;) but then again looking at my sb59 post which was one of many that we're closed to stop debate on it. I'm in the belief this is how Michigan is now moderated? It was closed bringing virtually the same thing Dan is saying today. I still think its quite disgusting that Michigan Open Carry supported a bill that criminalized open carry for the first time ever in Michigan in PFZs. Talk about a bill that contained a specific clause that couldn't be more contrary from what MOCs goals are. This forum is dead in my opinion. It only fosters arguments and fighting. Real discussions and debates on subjects don't happen here thanks to moderation if they disagree with OCDOs views or the moderators. Take a look at the poll that asked weather people agree with the last compromise and who doesn't. It speaks volumes. TheQs constant snarky posts go to show that he is unfit to lead any organization. To say that gun rights orgs are beyond reproach is laughable. It's about open carry and is well on topic. It's not off base to question weather so called gun rights orgs are going to continue supporting anti-open carry legislation. I expect to see it continuing and the fact they are still quiet about it means it's there any they want to minimize the exposure.

We'll agree OCDO Michigan is a cesspool. I don't blame the Forum management or moderation.
 

Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
The question is the same, but it is relevant to each new proposed legislation since Michigan gun organizations established that they may compromise OC to get proposals passed.

So, while my question is the same, it certainly is a very relevant question to get an answer on for each proposal, right?

I know. I am wondering what portion of my posts caused you to include me in your admonishment. I don't see anything I've written which need elicit a warning to me from you.

Please leave me out of your moderating unless I, myself, post something objectively needing moderation. That's what I'm asking for: please quote material from me that you believe, from a moderator viewpoint, is not allowable.

I respect this site and I'm here to learn if something I post is not allowable. Please quote my content that you perceive is not allowable.

Duplicate posts, and your back & forth with Q on the same. Multiple complaints received on same. It was headed for a major ******* contest, hence my comment.
 

Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
joke ;) This forum is dead in my opinion. It only fosters arguments and fighting.

And yet, you're still here. What keeps bringing you back, when you have your own, vibrant growing following on your website? Just trolling for membership?

You other threads & posts were deleted because you obviously had not read the proposed legislation, and weren't adding anything to the discussion. I was only trying to save you from embarrassing yourself further. You're welcome.

BTW, you violated a rule in your fabricated quotation attributed to me. Keep pushing the envelope, and see if you can deal with the sticky part...
 

DanM

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
1,928
Location
West Bloomfield, Michigan, USA
Duplicate posts . . .

Each piece of proposed legislation may have a different response on what the Michigan gun orgs are willing to compromise on, with regard to criminalizing parts or all of currently legal OC. Asking the question and tracking the possibly unique answer in each bill's thread seems logical. The start-off question is the same, but the answer for each bill quite possibly is different. Other than asking the question and tracking the possibly unique answers in each bill's thread, what is your suggestion on tracking this relevant question's answers for each bill?

. . . and your back & forth with Q on the same.

Q posts to me and I respond. My responses to him have been civil and addressing the particular content he posts to me. As far as I know, "back & forth" with someone isn't a problem, it's the content of each individual's postings that may be a problem. I don't believe my content in response to him warrants moderator sanction, is it the content he initiates to me that may warrant your sanction? Perhaps he initiates off-topic posts to me and he should stop doing that, maybe?

Multiple complaints received on same.

Are the complaints justified? The posts I initiate are relevant, on-topic or not too far off-topic, and civil. The world, and the internet, is full of complainers, you and I both know that. There are complaints, and then there are valid complaints. If you have a valid complaint against a post of mine, I guarantee you I will respectfully take your moderating guidance and comply with it, if you give to me my material that is offensive and explain how it is offensive, if it is not clear to me. I respect this site and objective moderation guidelines.

It was headed for a major ******* contest, hence my comment.

My posts are are relevant, on-topic or not too far off-topic, and civil. Are we non-hecklers responsible for where the hecklers take the discussion, or are the hecklers responsible for that, and they should be the ones whose posts or posting privileges moderated?
 
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