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Feeling Conflicted, cop assualts civilian and I'm not outraged

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
...sans the personal attack on my morals by one member...

Actually, I didn't say anything about your morals, but on second thought I have to agree that being a boot-licker is immoral.

Anyway, if you don't want me to give you a hard time, don't admit to me that you like watching police aggressively assault citizens. ;) I believe you when you say that on the balance you find the actions of the officer wrong, but I still think you asked for a gentle ribbing.

As a little aside, I would suggest that the following definition is a good one:

sycophant |ˈsikəfənt, -ˌfant|
noun
a person who acts obsequiously toward someone important in order to gain advantage.
 

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
It's amazing to me that the response to this thread had been unanimous dissent but the response to the thread where the NY police officer killed an innocent hostage has been mixed.

Frankly, I don't understand how there's anything to be mixed over on that one. Frankly, I'd take my chances on my own rather than have police "rescue" me by shooting my captor through me. If that's the best they can do, they should stay at home. But then, oh noes, laws might not be enfarced! Ensuring someone gets punished is far more important than trying to prevent anyone from being hurt. (Note: officers don't count. Any cop who thinks "officer safety" should be their top priority needs to go find a nice job collecting garbage. Not to mention that it would have been inarguably safer for all concerned – including the police – if they hadn't showed up.)

I truly wish those convictions would carry to the more egregious violations of liberty and life.

You can say that again.
 
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palerider116

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2010
Messages
572
Location
Unknown
Generalizations work both ways. That guy that robbed someone at gunpoint? Gun owner. The guy that shot and killed someone on the street corner? Gun owner. The guy who shot up a movie theater? Gun owner.

It is easy to make generalizations. Ease alone does not make it correct.

The same thing is constant between the cop that acts unconstitutionally or otherwise illegally and the citizen (gun owner) who kills or robs someone: both have violated an individual's natural (Locke) or God-given (Hobbes) rights.

Both are tyrants. Both are oppressors. They have taken or seized that which is not theirs. Killing someone is the pinnacle of seizure. I don't care if the government or a private individual has done it. I want justice. I want to be made whole again. I want this tyrant stopped. This tyrant has voided the social contract.

The cop who does illegal or unconstitutional acts is a tyrant or oppressor. The position allows him to act on ambitions or beliefs that were there before the badge. The other distinct possibility and is wholly reasonable is the cop is an idiot. Oppression caused by ignorance or fermented stupidity does not give one a pass.

Tyranny and oppression without government involvement will be met with the same veracity and opposition.

Fight the system by working within the system! Take it over from the inside out! Quit dying on the beachhead when you can infiltrate or parachute behind the lines!
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
Why is it that we never get any follow up information on this type of incident?
Will this idiot with a badge get off without any criminal or civil actions against him and if yes or no, will we hear about the outcome? I say no we will not. Therein lies part of the problem.

This LEO should be held criminally and there should be civil action bought against him personally. He should be fired, possibly jailed and hurt financially and he should be so embarrassed by his brutal actions that he and his family would have to relocate far far away.

CCJ
 

Freedom1Man

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
4,462
Location
Greater Eastside Washington
Generalizations work both ways. That guy that robbed someone at gunpoint? Gun owner. The guy that shot and killed someone on the street corner? Gun owner. The guy who shot up a movie theater? Gun owner.

It is easy to make generalizations. Ease alone does not make it correct.

The average gun owner would stop the criminal gun owner. I have yet to see the average cop stop a criminal cop.
 

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
Are you referring to your omnipresence or omniscience?

It's one of those fundamental truths that they expect you to accept without proof.

What it really is is bigotry.

Most people don't believe that crap. It is a noisy few trying to sound like they speak for a lot of people. Watch the screen names. It really is very few.
 

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
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Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
Saying a government system is bad/broken/corrupt is not the same thing as saying gun owners are bad because a few do bad things..........

But what is being bemoaned is not that the system is bad/broken/corrupt. It is comments that lump all cops together in generalizations about them. THAT is the same thing as generalizing to all gun owner because a few do bad things.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

<o>
 

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
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Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
It's one of those fundamental truths that they expect you to accept without proof.

What it really is is bigotry.

Most people don't believe that crap. It is a noisy few trying to sound like they speak for a lot of people. Watch the screen names. It really is very few.

Saying a government system is bad/broken/corrupt is not the same thing as saying gun owners are bad because a few do bad things..........

He's right, it is a generalization. What I've realized is that they're playing something very similar to the race card. What they're trying to imply, as a form of ad hominem attack designed to discredit the arguer, is that generalization must mean the person is speaking about all cops, which must mean they're bigoted, which must mean their opinion is merely a product of prejudice.

But it doesn't work that way. There's nothing wrong with generalizations in and of themselves. They may be right, and they may be wrong. The only time a generalization becomes prima facie invalid is when it is phrased in such a way as to apply to all members of a group.

Let's consider a few examples, shall we?

Generalizations without merit:

• Black people are criminals.

• Southern conservatives are racist, xenophobic KKK members.

• It is always cold when it is rainy.

• Gun owners are law-abiding.

• Cops are evil.


Generalizations which do not purport to apply to every member of the group, and which may have merit:

• Black folks commit more violent crimes than while folks.

• Most conservatives oppose gun control.

• It is generally chilly when it rains.

• The average gun owner is law-abiding.

• The average cop will cover for the "bad apples" in their ranks.
 
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golddigger14s

Activist Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2010
Messages
2,068
Location
Lawton, OK USA
I'd buy the cop a cup of coffee. The punk with the attitude deserved to get it straightened out. I did 21 years in the Army, and would never use my military status/rank in an off duty event. Being an a-hole will never help the situation.
 

marshaul

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
11,188
Location
Fairfax County, Virginia
I'd buy the cop a cup of coffee. The punk with the attitude deserved to get it straightened out. I did 21 years in the Army, and would never use my military status/rank in an off duty event. Being an a-hole will never help the situation.

Great. Let's just have police assault and batter every person they deem to have an "attitude". That'll show 'em!
 

Ca Patriot

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Feb 25, 2010
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, ,
I'd buy the cop a cup of coffee. The punk with the attitude deserved to get it straightened out. I did 21 years in the Army, and would never use my military status/rank in an off duty event. Being an a-hole will never help the situation.

So does that mean since I don't like YOUR attitude that I can assault you and then lock you in a cage ?

Maybe we should just make "attitude" a criminal offense.
 

eye95

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Joined
Jan 6, 2010
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Fairborn, Ohio, USA
I'd buy the cop a cup of coffee. The punk with the attitude deserved to get it straightened out. I did 21 years in the Army, and would never use my military status/rank in an off duty event. Being an a-hole will never help the situation.

If the punk deserves to be straightened out, it should be by another punk. The law, which LEOs are supposed to represent, shouldn't be straightening anyone out.

This cop assaulted the punk, but the kid being a punk doesn't make the assault legal.
 

palerider116

Regular Member
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Nov 14, 2010
Messages
572
Location
Unknown
If the punk deserves to be straightened out, it should be by another punk. The law, which LEOs are supposed to represent, shouldn't be straightening anyone out.

This cop assaulted the punk, but the kid being a punk doesn't make the assault legal.

I agree.

The law is the law, and an officer of law must uphold it first by example, then by enforcement.

The courts and the penal system are for "straightening people out."
 

countryclubjoe

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
2,505
Location
nj
The Fed's need to get involved in these incidents.

A goverment employee assaulting a citizen and violating the citizens rights.

The leo should be charged under 18 U.S.C. section 242. ( Criminal Civil Rights Statutes)

Deprivation of rights under color of law.

Then the citizen should file a civil suit under 42 U.S.C. section 1983 against the LEO and LEO police department.

On a side note the citizen is clearly and A hole however even A holes have rights.

CCJ
 
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